Raidless in Seattle
“Dear BRK, I suffer from a terrible plight right now, nothing short of the dreaded ‘Only Marks spec is viable to raid’. And it’s hardly a ‘we’ situation, being my beloved pet is now so much less effective. So, after having to leave my last guild because they would never see the dizzying heights of Kara, I joined
“I desperately wanted to raid, so with much bitterness and a proliferation of apology to Hemmingway, my cat, I hit the button to unlearn my talents. Not long after I wondered why anyone would like TSA more than Ferocious Inspiration. And whether Hemmingway would ever again be big, red and… well, just big and red.
“I still came second on the DPS charts, but I can’t help but feel that cocky mage would have got what was coming to him had I been able to do what hunters everywhere do best, i.e. “massive amounts of sustained, ranged DPS” and not “keep serpent sting up, ffs”.
“I guess I’ll need to either tough it out, or go where proper hunters are really appreciated. Thanks for being an inspiration, and convincing me long ago not to be part of the problem. Cheers, Okssen & a not-so-big-and-red-Hemmingway.”
Well you know every commenter is going to preach “Leave the B@stages!” but dig a little deeper before you throw the /gquit tantrum. Get you, your guild’s Main Tank and your GM in a private channel. Explain to them the difference between Serpent and Scorpid Sting and what it means about pushing crushing blows off the tank’s Things to Worry About list. Let the MT voice his opinion of which sting he’d prefer.
If he chooses Serpent, you know you gotta leave. If he chooses Scorpid and the GM still insists on Serpent, you know you gotta leave. If they both say, “Yeah, Scorpid sounds good,” you have your opening to discuss all the other ways in which you know how to help the raid.
The number one way, of course, is to provide massive quantities of sustained, ranged DPS as a Beastmaster hunter.
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19 Responses to “Raidless in Seattle”
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Its just like being in any guild if you can give good reason to be X/Y spec then reasonable people should accept it. Along with the whole scorpid/serpent sting issue. The only time I apply that in instances is if the mobs is a caster type and even then I’m better off popping more steady/arcane shots than wasting that mana on serpent sting.
As a side note I hate trolls like this one that showed up on the WoW forums today. http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=1531116223&sid=1
Leave the bastages.
Talk to your CL, if he agrees that marks is the only viable spec, gquit.
I have a bit of experience with CLs (A few forum threads o’ drama), and they will ALWAYS overshadow you. I know it sucks, but you can continue to be friends with the people in the guild. I’m not on speaking terms with the CL yet, but hey, its a start. Just be sure to go quietly, and if you make any threads on the forums, do it on a level 3 alt. The armory is teh dramaz!
My friend, Big Red Cow, chose to join a different guild, but only if he stayed as a BM hunter. He made a simple deal with them- I will hit 1 or 2 on the DPS charts. If I fail to do so I will respec or quit. They were willing to take him and give him a chance as a BM hunter. I am a prot warrior and have learned the value of a talented BM hunter…indispensable.
Oh man have I been in this hunter’s boots! I was fortunate in that the offending raid leader had a major melt down with the GM and was kicked from the guild. I spoke at lengths with the GM (he has both a 70 hunter and a 70 priest) and got him to at least consider BM spec as a viable raid configuration. A few 5-mans, AQ and ZF runs later, he was more than convinced!
Leaving the guild wasn’t really an option, since there aren’t many (any?) that recruit hunters on my server. I would have had to apply to guilds on other servers, and since I had recently followed the GM to this server, I was stuck for a while. I’m glad I toughed it out, but it was a pretty miserable existence for a while. Things turned out well, and I am now the GM’s second in command. Logic can prevail - it just takes time.
We’re a small “casual” guild and still struggling with Kara (Moroes). So small, in fact, that we can hardly get a team together, much less an “A” team!
for the pie stole my line
/mope
I was so glad when I joined my current guild, Prestige on Kargath, because they were open to different specs. When I converted to BM I got the usual groans of worry about how gimped I now was and how my pet would die all the time. Last night we had our first successful kill of Gruul and I’m happy to say I topped the damage meters. My pet does die on occasion and it is usually my fault for losing track of him but with Improved Revive and Improved Mend he is back on his feet and shredding faces in no time.
Rather than quit a guild, at least try to convert them to the joy that is the Beastmaster. If, after some healthy discussion, they won’t at least allow you to join a raid and prove your worth, kick them to the curb, transfer to Kargath and give Flowbee a shout. I’ll hook ya up!
Flowbee and his faithful companion Firecrotch
I think the big thing here is to be able to explain the spec in a logical manner. In my current guild there was noone that understood how the BM spec got it’s DPS from, but “they had heard” that it was good damage. After I explained Serpents Swiftness, a Auto-Steady shot rotation, and the improvement to Mend Pet (the cast HoT vs channeled) they not only accept that I am BM, they encourage it. The S. Priest, Lock and mage I get grouped with in Kara LOVE FI.
There’s always the sneaky way. REspec back to BM. Don’t tell anyone. Anyone asks why your TSA isn’t up, you tell them your interface is bugged and it hasn’t been working. >.>
Then go forth and top the damage meters for a few raids.
WIN.
@suzanne don’t you think a huge red cat and hunter would be a bit hard to confuse with MM? hehe.
Incidentally, the only boss my guild/s have ever told me to put the cat away on is Maiden.
New guild, I didn’t bother asking, just sent him in COS BRK SAID SO.
Sustained all of about 5HP damage during entire fight >< . I almost died but DALEK WAS FINE.
So have now done (first time for me) a full kara clear in basically two days with cat on every boss - no problemo.
Nah. I did think of that and thought the person who sent in the question might know better than to let pet go BRK when trying to sneak in BM spec. Whoever is running damage meters is probably being dumb and not merging pet data anyways. >.>
Just let FI add the damage on and see who’s knowledgable enough to know FI only comes from the BM tree. >.> You probably are already aware of how many people are ignorant of what other class trees do unless they play that class themselves. (And even those who play the class themselves are clueless at times too)
WTB stack of [Understanding of Avoidance]?
I think all but one or two of our (many) 70 Hunters are BRK-specced 41/20/0 or very similar. Our guild’s philosophy has always been, we don’t tell you how to play your toon, if you don’t play like a retard at the expense of everyone else. Stunningly effective.
All but one of our raiding hunters is BM spec - and that one only joined the guild a week or so ago. Our best BM hunter typically tops the damage meters even while he chain-traps his way through Kara.
- Lypi
Wow, didn’t think my email would grace the first page.
But just as something of a followup, if this guild is willing to take a hunter in 115 blues to Gruul’s (Just downed the High King, thankyou very much), I think I’ll tough it out for a little longer.
I did gently switch back to Scorpid this evening. 25-man debuffs make it less of a feat.
And Hemmingway only died on the wipes. He’ll be big and red again soon.
Serpent Sting is a major nuisance in 25 mans. With a few locks and shadow priests, you will likely hit the debuff limit. It hurts the entire raid to have a powerfull dot or debuff knocked off by a lame Serpent Sting. Scorpid Sting on the other hand, provides a valuable benefit to the MT.
-knock-knock-
Hey Dave? It’s Ragnaros. 2005 want’s their hunter prejudices back.
mc raider, show me where I’m wrong. Show me how the damage from a Serpent Sting is greater than the damage from Unstable Affliction or the benefit of Curse of Elements.
Even though the debuff limit has been increased, it’s still easy in 25 mans to hit the limit and knock off debuffs. And to knock off a more powerful debuff and replace it with a weak dot isn’t exactly a FTW strategy.
But go ahead, show me.
Dave, you may not be wrong. But you’re certainly not right. “Serpent Sting is bad, mmm’kay?” is a foolish attitude, right up with “BM hunters are useless in a raid”.
Serpent Sting is a tool. BM Hunters are a tool. Survival hunters are a tool. Feral kitty druids are a tool. All tools are useless if you don’t have the brains or attention to use them intelligently.
If you want a pure by the numbers comparison, you would end up stacking your raid with all rogues since they are the “highest single-target sustained dps class”.
So here’s the situation. You have a 40-debuff limit on a mob, yes? Default UI shows about 20 to 25 total debuffs. Your 25-man raid can easily stack 40 debuffs… maybe. How many of those are sustained the entire fight? Do any classes drop to a reduced debuff rotation to conserve mana, or perhaps maximize energy? Are you stacking tanks and healers and going light on non-direct damage classes? Is the mob immune to certain effects, lowering the total debuff limits? Are there adds that will not get the full raid focus? Are there multiple tanked targets that split the raid’s attention?
You give me one example: comparing a sting to an obviously superior DoT, and ask me to prove you wrong.
I’m not going to play that game. I’m going to argue that “Serpent Sting is bad, mmm’kay?” is an outdated and useless attitude, much like “Beastmastery is useless, huntard noob.” I’m telling you that your hunters should be striving to make the most of all the tools available to them, especially as only one hunter is required to keep a Scorpid on a primary tanking target.
I’m assuming that the hunters that read BRK are a slice above the huntard masses that sting up CC and blindly DPS with no reguards to agro.
I’m assuming that the hunters coming here are intelligent enough to use the tools at their disposal appropriately, and not overwrite a CoD with a Serpent Sting. And yes, I will argue that there is a time and a place for Serpent Sting, and that most raiding hunters are able to judge that on the fly and use it appropriately… and if not, can be trained or corrected individually, instead of having a raid rule to take SS off your hotbar.
So back at’cha Dave.
I say a Serpent Sting is better than an empty debuff spot. Care to argue with me there?
LOL MC raider says hunters are tools….hehe