The Fallacy of Spell Hit and Traps
“Dear BRK, please, please … talk about spell hit and its correlation with Freezing Trap.
“The reason I’m asking is because I’ve noticed that my traps are being resisted a lot more and traps are breaking earlier than they’re supposed to lately. I just got into doing heroics two weeks ago and I think it has something to do the level of the mobs I’m trapping and their resistances, but I’m not quite sure. I’ve read somewhere (in your forums) that by adding spell hit, the chances of one’s traps being resisted will reduce, as well as it breaking early.
“Can you kindly shed a light with regards to this? Like, how many points should I try to invest in spell hit? I was thinking of re-gemming two of the Beast Lord Set for the trap bonus. Jim.”
Let’s start this investigate with a definition, shall we?
“Spell hit is a combat attribute that increases a caster’s chance to hit with spells.” So sayeth WoWWiki, so let it be done.
But what does that mean?
When Mr. Warrior smacks something upside the noggin with his sword, he can Hit or Miss. When he Misses, his combat text says, YA MISSED, NOOBCAKES!
When Mr. Mage conjures and launches a fireball at the same target, he too can Hit or Miss. When he Misses, his combat text says, SPELL RESISTED, NOOBSAUCE!
This is where the confusion sets in for hunters. When we miss a shot, we know we Missed. When a Mage misses a spell, he too Misses but the game calls it a Resist. There is a difference, let’s see what it is.
When Mr. Warrior smacks something upside the noggin with his sword, he can Hit or Miss. When he Hits, sometimes the full effect of the attack is diminished. This is known as Mitigation, and shows up on combat logs and in WWS reports.
Mr. Mage conjures and launches a fireball, he misses. This is called a Resist. Mr. Mage conjures and launches another fireball, he hits his target, but the mob Resists some of the damage from the spell. This is the real Resist, and it too shows up in combat logs and in WWS reports.
As you can see, there are duplicate dynamics at work:
1. Both melee and spells can Hit or Miss. For melee, a miss is a Miss. For spells, a miss is a Resist.
2. Both melee and spells can have their effects diminished. For melee, a dimished attack is a Mitigation. For spells, a diminished attack is a Resist.
How does one make one’s melee attacks hit more frequently? With Hit and Expertise ratings.
How does Hit work? We’ve covered that before; it reduces one’s chance to Miss, actually. The chance to miss is based upon the differences between the attacker’s skill rating and the defender’s Defense rating, as well as the difference between the attacker’s and defender’s level.
How does Expertise work? Expertise reduces a chance an enemy will Dodge or Parry one’s attack.
How does one avoid a melee attack? Dodge, Parry, Block, by being a higher level than the attacker, and causing a Miss by having a higher Defense rating than the attacker’s weapon skill rating.
How does one avoid a spell attack? By being a higher level than the attacker, that’s it. For equal-level opponents, the spell attacker will have a 96% chance to hit with his spell.
How does one mitigate melee attacks? Armor.
How does one mitigate spell attacks? Resistances.
So what is the spell caster’s equivalent of Hit? You got it; Spell Hit. If you read notes about Spell Hit, they’ll say that it reduces the chances a spell will be Resisted, but read that carefully. What it really means is that it reduces the chances a spell will Miss.
And what really reduces the chances that a spell will be Resisted?
Spell Penetration, foshizzle.
Spell Penetration reduces a target’s resistances to spells. If you’ve got a dwarf with the +10 Frost Resistance racial, a mage will need some Spell Penetration to counter that resistance when attacking with frost spells in order for his spell damage to not be mitigated.
Got it? When one Hits with a spell, the defender can have the damage mitigated with Resistances, but the attacker can overcome those resistances with Spell Penetration.
Let’s bring this all back to Hunters and their traps.
You drop a Freezing Trap and trap a mob. With every tick, that mob has a chance to Resist your trap-spell. If that mob has high magic resistances, like those that inhabit Karazhan, the chance that they’ll Resist your trap increases. Since the mob was trapped, you Hit it; any mechanic that affects initial trap Miss/Resist has been rendered moot.
To decrease the chance that that trapped mob will break early, i.e. to decrease the chance your trap-spell will be Resisted, you need Spell Penetration, not Spell Hit.
Freaky, eh? You bet.
“But BRK, what about the initial Resist? You know, when that mob runs over your trap and he immediately Resists? Was that a spell Miss or a spell Resist?”
Now this is where it gets murky. According to all the research we’re read, Spell Hit should decrease the chance that traps will be Missed. The question is: does Blizz consider that initial trap Hit/Miss a Miss or a Resist?
We’re of the opinion that all trap mechanics are Resists. We arrived at this conclusion based upon two things:
1. The Trap Mastery talent tooltip:
“Decreases the chance that enemies will resist trap effects by X%.”
It would make little sense for a hunter to get the uber-trap talents and have no bonuses to avoiding that initial trap-Miss. We must assume that an initial Miss is calculated in a fashion similar to a ticking-Resist.
2. We are aware of no mathematical evidence that shows that Spell Hit affects trap Misses/Resists. There has been research into Spell Hit and trap mechanics and no correlation has been seen. This bolsters our assumption that traps are only Resisted, as Spell Hit should indeed affect whether traps are initially Hit or Missed/Resisted.
Instead, we believe that Spell Penetration will work in the same manner as Trap Mastery when it comes to initial and ticking trap Resists.
As we stated, there has been research to determine if Spell Hit affects trapping, and those results indicate that there is no correlation.
But, and this is a Big But, we are unable to find any research into Spell Penetration and its effect on trapping; all our yapping here is conjecture. Now we think it’s pretty solid conjecture and it all falls into line with the rest of the spell-mechanics in the game.
But we could be 100%, totally wrong. It’s not a habit to which we’re accustomed, but the probability exists.



Fiordhraoi on 29 Dec 2007 at 10:42 am #
I’m not sure if either Spell Hit or Spell penetration applies to freezing traps. However, I do know that spell penetration is 99.9% useless in PvE. Why? Because mobs don’t have resistances beyond the base chance for a spell to miss/fail (the formula for which is based on comparative levels). There are a very few exceptions - arcane watchmen in Karazhan have arcane resist, some of the MC mobs have fire resist. I think in total it is something ridiculous like 5 mobs in the entire game. Blizzard tends to make mobs either completely vulnerable or totally immune to any given school of magic.
So, that being said, even if you had 400 spell penetration, it would do absolutely zero in virtually every PvE situation out there. You can’t reduce a zero resistance any more. So even if spell penetration did help freezing trap “hit” more often, it would only apply in PvP where someone is likely to have frost resistance.
Anonymous on 29 Dec 2007 at 11:10 am #
regardless… isn’t it a pretty bad idea to give up AGI or AP or +Hit or +Crit or just about anything for any sort of +Spell whatever if you’re a hunter?
an interesting discussion as to whats going on under the hood, but think the main point should be “drop trap early so can drop another if it gets resisted or mitigated or whatever”
BRK on 29 Dec 2007 at 11:14 am #
Most correct, anonymous. Don’t try to get Spell Penetration to make your traps better, use better techniques to recover from a bad trap.
Unless you’re doing Research. In that case, go nutty with Spell Penetration and let us know your results.
mwahahah on 29 Dec 2007 at 11:56 am #
Interesting post.
(wish i were able to get some of +penetration gear to test things out)
but anyway:
When are u going to change your signature on the signature page into the cute cartoon (with hobbes! ^^) ? o.O’
(it still has the default non-huggable blackbeard dwarf on it :c)
Robert on 29 Dec 2007 at 12:33 pm #
I swear I remember Blizz changing the mechanics of traps in 2.3 so that +hit (not spell hit) would affect trapping. I’ll check out Elitist Jerks for the details.
ailtia on 29 Dec 2007 at 12:51 pm #
very interesting read but all the noobsauce and noobcake had made me hungry…store anyone?
Varenda - hunter ex Madoran on 29 Dec 2007 at 2:47 pm #
Spelling mistake BRK - it’s - the probability exists not probably.
For the Pie on 29 Dec 2007 at 3:17 pm #
that’s not a spelling mistake Varenda, it’s a word mistake.
Ansawa on 29 Dec 2007 at 4:16 pm #
Interesting.
I was just about to go ‘zomg wtf bbq i should get spell penetration gear for heroix’, but I think I’m better served by respec’ing to a 41/0/20 build until I can get better gear.
Nerfs my DPS, but I stop dying due to trap resists and early breaks, and a dead hunter has 0 DPS.
Oh, and the two piece set bonus on Beast Lord makes me whimper with ecstasy when combined with Clever Traps and Trap Mastery. Now I just need to wait for 2.3.2 to put double-trapping back in so I can go practice it more.
Euripedes on 29 Dec 2007 at 5:41 pm #
Spell Penetration is a stat that is, quite bluntly, painfully useless.
Essentially, like BRK said, it overcomes the target’s spell resistances. In PvE there are so few mobs with spell resistances, and none past Karazhan. Those within Karazhan include only the one mob type, again mentioned above.
Now, same as how you need to stack spell hit to overcome the defences of higher level mobs, so do higher level mobs have great spell resistances.
Math wise, a level 73 mob (raid boss) would have an innate spell resist against all spells of 24. However, this amount of spell resist cannot be overcome by any amount of spell resist.
Like Fio said, useless.
Spell Penetration is very much a stat for PvP, and is not very useful in that field either. Its very rare where you will come across people with high values of spell resist, in general you would only ever need to worry about shadow resists from priests and druids MotW.
Quite bluntly, it is not worth it to stack spell penetration for use in PvP as a caster. There are far better stats to choose from. Such as Stamina. Or resilience.
And besides, from a Mage standpoint, Blizzard has already done the spell penetration calculating for you.
10 Spell Penetration on the ring, and 20 for the cloak enchant, and thats all the penetration you will ever need to have. Negates that whole MotW thing rather nicely.
And besides, being able to say “I have the Ring of Domination, and it has Penetration on it!” just never gets old.
jumb on 29 Dec 2007 at 10:10 pm #
The word “fallacy” always reminds me of the word “phallus” for some reason.
Happyshot (Skywall-A) on 30 Dec 2007 at 3:15 pm #
I beg to differ that spell hit has no effects on traps. I levelled using a 41/0/20 (”BM / traps”) build, and ran instances extensively, so I know how handy the trap talents are. I currently run heroic instances with a 40/21/0 (”BM / Scatter Shot”) build. Losing the trap talents caused a noticeably higher rate of trap resists and early trap breaks.
I then picked up a 63 spell hit rating “trap suit”. This much hit rating essentially provides as much “resist reduction” as Improve Traps (against up to level 62 mobs). Trapping using this gear (which also includes 2pc Beastlord) makes traps easy to manage (more time to delivery massive qualities of sustained range DPS! ^^ ). Most noticeable is the rate at which traps fail disastrously (two resists in quick succession, which leaves an angry mob next to you or making for the healer): with the trap suit, it happens once every 5 or 6 instances; without the trap suit, it often happens more than once an instance.
For my trap suit, I use the following:
Beast Lord Mantle (socketed / enchanted for DPS)
Beast Lord Handguards (socketed with 2x 8 spell hit, enchanted with 15 spell hit)
Girdle of Living Flame (item provides 16 spell hit, socketed with 2x 8 spell hit) — yes, you basically give up this gear slot in exchange for effective trapping : /
I would highly recommend to any hunters instancing without trap talents to try this out for themselves before speculating on the effectiveness of spell hit. If you’re on a budget, you can use 6 spell hit gems (which are much, much cheaper, esp if you get them direct from a JC)… you’ll just need to socket 2 more of them to hit the magical 63 spell hit rating. Scryers have a 32 spell hit trinket available at exalted, which can entirely replace the belt.
Fedaykin98 on 31 Dec 2007 at 11:22 am #
Imho - and purely imho - even if there are ways to gear to improve your trapping abilities (or go 41/0/20, like the gentleman above), it is totally not worth it to nerf your DPS in favor of more reliable traps. Even if you could get to foolproof traps it would not be worth it, because as BRK hath said, the mission of a Hunter is to provide massive quantities of sustained ranged DPS.
You shouldn’t surrender the mission in order to decrease the number of still-inevitable bad traps. Most traps work well already; if you trade DPS for fewer resists, etc., you are decreasing your usefulness as a DPSer in all fights in exchange for greater usefulness as a CCer in some fights. Not a good trade, imho.
Or to put it in practical terms: I’d rather have to fight Moroes twice because a trap broke than not down Curator at all because there isn’t enough DPS.
Not a Hunter, btw, just a fan of them, and a raving BRK fanatic. =D
anonymous on 31 Dec 2007 at 11:48 am #
I think what the writer of the letter meant to do is just swapping out the 2 Beast Lord Set with +spell hit during trash mobs (or MAYBE, during Moroes) when he is assigned to CC (which is obviously most of the time).. And just swapping back in his DPS gear during boss fights in which trapping is not necessary (i.e. Curator)..
So, yes, a hunter will gimp his DPS a little during trash pulls, but will provide a reliable CC throughout, which imho, is very important.. And just to remember to swap his gear before boss fights or he’ll end up losing A LOT of damage..
And btw, happy new year to you BRK and to all!
Doug on 03 Jan 2008 at 2:09 pm #
If the trap breaks…why not just kite the mob?
bigdid on 03 Jan 2008 at 5:40 pm #
Hi and HNYear,
To Doug, cause you are supposed to trap AND dps the main target or as assigned…
I’m scryers so I will try the trinket ( 32SH) with 2x 6 spell hit gems which makes 44 actually, change to 2x 8 if positive, more if affinities…
Did (french reader and 70 Hunter)
bigdid on 06 Jan 2008 at 11:31 am #
Update on my older post..
I went to steam vault with +44 spell hit gear to test the naga’s trap resist.
I got 1 initial resist (2 in fact but I forgot to change gear back after the first boss) when I had 3 or 4 before. So I suppose it is going the right way.
I will change the 2 +6 by +8 (total will be 48) and see if I have some improvements to test in the steam vault cause I still need the beast leggins…
I also have the 2 slots necklace I can equip if needed, so I will update this post eventually after more testing..
Did
Fjurr on 08 Jan 2008 at 9:42 am #
Hmm interesting reading. It truly is painful as hell when your traps get resisted or just brake way to early.
Has anyone noticed any changes in the trap duration whan adding spell hit to ze “trapping suit”?
Shelagh on 14 Jan 2008 at 1:45 am #
Traps resists seem to work in the same way that spell resists work for mages? Frost resistance is binary, it either resists completely or it doesn’t resist at all whereas fore resistance is usually a percentage which is when your spell does a proportion of the damage it is supposed to.