How to Accept Help
Note: This is not a letter to BRK.
“I just need to get this off my chest, it’s been bothering me. I’m fairly new to WoW, but I seem to be able to hold my own for sure. Yesterday, a group of us guildies, two of which I’d never met before, got together to go help finish up a quest in Arathi for a newer guy. I’m a 43 Hunter, still a baby yes, but I feel confident in my abilities. A 70, who I’d never met before, joined us to help out. So we’re standing there, figuring out coordinates and game plan and the 70 pipes up all the sudden stating how I’m wearing all the wrong clothes. Hmmm….don’t remember asking.
“It just irritates me. Go ahead, inspect, but I don’t think it’s polite to pipe up and start going all ‘I know everything’ when you first meet a person. Am I wrong ladies? How does she/he know if I just happen to pick clothes because I like how they look, it’s no one’s business but my own what I choose to wear. I wasn’t getting killed off and everyone having to wait for me all the time because my gear stinks. I wasn’t getting anyone else killed due to pathetic playing or lack of power. My clothing choice was affecting no one.
“I just recently started being able to wear mail and I’ve been playing around with what seems to work. I understand that them being a 70 means they’ve got more experience in the game, but I’m not really that hard core, I like to take my time, wear what I like and do things for fun. Besides, how does the 70 know that I don’t have a 70 myself, not in that guild or on that realm.
“I just needed to rant about that, I felt that he/she was being very rude and ‘know it all’. Thanks for listening to my complaining gals, you guys are the very best and if I want advice from anyone, I’ll be asking you guys!
“Okay…what should a hunter be wearing? What am I doing so wrong? Here’s what I wearing now.
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=B________&n=M_______
“Any input from you guys would be appreciated and welcomed. My husband gave me the rings, so they have sentimental value. c:”
We saw this post on WoWLadies and it made us sit up and pay attention. The writer’s gear-issues were adroitly handled by the denizens, as usual. Dump the Strength and Spirit gear, concentrate on Agility and Stamina, etc.
But there are two things that bothered us. First, nobody bothered to do a talent-spec analysis. Let’s gander at her points:
Thirty-four talent points in the BM tree. Good for going BM, but we need to talk about the distribution, don’t we
Aspect of the Hawk AND Endurance Training is a big No.
Improved Pathfinding is another honkin’ No.
Skipping Improved Mend Pet is a No of the worst order.
Animal Handler in non-raiding situations is also a No.
Skipping Bestial Discipline is a criminal No.
No Frenzy? Can’t get much more No than that.
How should these point be placed? Something like this would be much better for leveling:
The big problems are thusly corrected. The next point completes Unleashed Fury, then the next five complete Serpent’s Swiftness. Bingo bango bungo, you’ve got a helacious DPS-machine built.
Is Ferocious Inspiration critical for leveling? Nah, we could’ve chosen Spirit Bond or Catlike Reflexes and been happy. But this is a much more lethal 34-point killing-machine build than the other, snd that’s what being a hunter is all about.
But the second problem is even more critical than the first.
“My clothing choice was affecting no one.”
Oh it most certainly was affecting someone. It was affecting the wearer’s ability to do her job, it was affecting the rest of her party as they had to carry her weight, and it was affecting her guild, whose reputation was just affected by her choices.
“Dude, I ran this 43 hunter in Pax Vobiscum through some quests, what a mess. How can they let her remain ignorant? Why aren’t they helping her? What’s wrong with Pax Vobiscum?”
And don’t think this doesn’t happen, either.
But the final person it affected was the 70 who felt compelled to help her out, even if he was gruff and clumsy in his delivery.
Is everybody ready to accept criticism? Nope. Are they required to listen to critiques of their gear? No way. Does everybody who offers advice have a bleeping clue what they’re talking about? Ha! No they do not.
But if someone walks up to you and tries to offer some guidance, think about their motives.
“Dude! Ur gear sux!” is indicative of someone not looking to help, but to laugh at your expense. Feel free to /ignore them.
“Did you know that hunter’s don’t get any benefits from Strength? Just because it’s mail, doesn’t mean you should wear it,” is the sign of someone trying to help you.
But why are they trying to help you? Because they feel superior to you and want to rub your nose in your ignorance and laugh? Not usually.
They want to help you because they know what it’s like to get started and not understand the mechanics of the game. WoW can be difficult, as the game does not give you clues as to how to maximize and most efficiently build your toon. One must do research OUT of the game to get the most fun IN the game.
When we see you with +Str on your helm, we know you haven’t done the necessary research. But we assume that you don’t know that you have to do research! That’s why we will do blind tells to people and question them about the gear selections.
“Why do you have a +Str helm?”
“Because it’s the only mail helm I can find.”
“Did you know that a lot of easy-to-get leather helms are better for you at level 43 than most all mail helms?”
“Really?” And the learning begins.
Don’t be too quick to dismiss the legions of WoW Helpers out there, even if they do offer you unrequested advice. Now if he’s a total jerk, please feel free to condemn the messenger.
Just don’t automatically throw his message out with him.
Comments
87 Responses to “How to Accept Help”
/cheer
Agree 100% to everything.
However, humility isn’t one a strong point of most WoW players.
Just to comment on your suggestions:
“Improved Pathfinding is another honkin’ No.”
- Not necessarly, leveling up one of the most annoying things is how slowly you move about, running sucks. So she might have got these talents for that. However as she has reached 40 and probably got a mount then they can probably be dropped. But pre 40 this can be quite nice. If you find getting from place to place to be fustratingly slow, then this talent can ease your pain alittle.
“Skipping Improved Mend Pet is a No of the worst order.”
- Again not exactly necessary, handy sure, but definitely not essential.
4/5 Frenzy is plenty as she will be starting to put talents into serpent swiftness, along with cobra reflexes (can she have that at her lvl?)
“Animal Handler in non-raiding situations is also a No.”
Animal Handler is still good outside of raids. Remember you (and pet) have 5% miss rate against same lvl mobs. And as a hunter lvling up you should always be on mobs your lvl, or maybe a couple of lvls higher. So Animal handler is fully useful as you level. And it makes it easier to have just 4/5 in Frenzy. And just a big a factor is the mount speed increase, definitely worthwhile.
BRK, remember your own advice, your not necessarly correct either. Your have great writing style, but your Hunter advice could use a little tweaking at times. Try to remember other persectives.
Got to comment on your suggested talent build aswell, sorry.
- You only have 4/5 Unleashed Fury ?! That extra point is a straight up 4% Pet dmg.
- Endurance Training, probably should have kept those points in Improved Hawk, you just don’t need the extra stamina when lvling tbh.
- Mentioned it above, but 4/5 Frenzy is plenty.
My suggestion of a build for her would be:
http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/hunter/talents.html?5020320150501224110000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
- The two points in Improved Revive can be moved around abit, Improved Mend Pet or Soul Bond, just go with whatever picks your fancy.
And for her next 6 points I would suggest the following order:
1-Ferocious Inspriation
5-Ferocious Inspiration
1-Beast Within
-After that start working up the Marks Tree.
Oh, and not sure what pet she has but should check to see if she can get: Cobra Reflexes, Dash, Claw and Bite.
In general, a question on wow_ladies gets a lot more answers about gear than spec. My guess, from personal experience, is that it’s a lot easier to pick up basics for other classes’ gear.
For example, spell casters. Gear priorities for spellcasters are usually going to go hit > damage > crit. So, a moonkin and a mage aren’t going to have different gear stat priorities, leaving each with the ability to offer advice to the other. Same with casting gear, locks, mages, shadow priests, moonkin and some elemental shaman are all going to have been eye-balling the same bits of gear and quest chains, leaving each with a fair amount of relevant advice for the other.
There’s a similar cross-over with melee classes, tanking classes, and healing classes, in regards to gear, enchants and gems.
However, good advice for a spec is class dependent and sometimes even spec dependent. A feral druid probably can’t give in-depth advice to an enhancement shaman, nor a moonkin for a feral druid. So, I believe people tend to not comment on specs, because they know it’s not their area of expertise. The number of beast master hunters is far smaller than the number of people who know that spirit isn’t a melee stat.
As far as armor my new hunter on Drenden is lv. 52 now and I still have some leather armor on him, I cant find any good mail and everything in AH they want 8 to 10g for greens that I will level out of in 2 or 3 days….
And trying to help other people that are full on the way of being huntards there is a girl in the guild im in we got off to a bad start with a little fight in guild chat(she said I was gay I said some real nice things back everyone but her thought it was funny) than I grouped with her in ZF she would run up and pull stuff before we were ready and not even send her pet, all of us tried to say something she ended up getting mad and leaving the group so I tried to get her to let me show her a couple things and that makes her mad….
p.s. If anyone knows of a good guild on Drenden server let me know. Right now I’m in a leveling guild and everyone I have grouped with have no idea what they are doing and it turns out worse than a pug. He is 52 now but I have been leveling 1 level a day so it won’t be long till I hit 60….
@ Aryzel:
“- You only have 4/5 Unleashed Fury ?! That extra point is a straight up 4% Pet dmg.”
You should read what he wrote instead of just looking at the pic:”The next point completes Unleashed Fury…”
“- Endurance Training, probably should have kept those points in Improved Hawk, you just don’t need the extra stamina when lvling tbh.”
I’m going to disagree. When I was levelling I spent most of my time in cheetah aspect and the rest in viper. Also you’re right, you don’t really need the stamina but your pet does.
@jumb
Why have 4/5 Unleashed fury, but 5/5 Frenzy ? swap them around. The 5th point in UF is worth more there than almost anywhere else. BM dmg is roughly split 65-35 (hunter-pet), so +4% pet dmg, comes out at about 1.4% overall dmg increase. In comparison 1% crit for the hunter only gives 0.65% increase in overall dmg. Also pet doing more dmg means he has more ago, which means the hunter can do more dps earlier.
On Endurance/Hawk, it probably is down more to your play style I suppose. Its being about 3 years since I leveled up Aryzel so I might be alittle out of date on what is needed at the lower levels
I’ve found Improved Hawk rarely procs for me during a fight, usually at the end when I can’t use it.. and when it does during the fighting, it ups my DPS too much to keep a mob on my pet. IAotH is delicious in raid settings, but for me personally it had been useless for grinding. Viper had proved more efficient, allowing me to keep going longer without having to worry about occasional sudden bursts of higher DPS to make my kitty panic.
It’s quite possible other people have similar problems with it. I’ve always liked having a ton of stamina on my tankypets, and I’d reccomend the same for anyone else levelling or grinding a lot. It might not be the fastest, or ideal in theorycrafted situations, but it worked for me.
Ah, fair enough.
I too wore a lot of gear for looks up until 40 or so… it was fun to match my stuff, etc.
I know better now… but I question the no spirit bond… I think that would give you that extra bit of health to live through those touchy situations…
Here’s the deal…I’m not going to argue why or why not someone should or should not have x out of y points in z. Here is a key sentence everyone missed…”I’m fairly new to WoW, but I seem to be able to hold my own for sure.”
When I was level 43 as a hunter, I was wearing Herod’s Shoulder. Why? A) It looked cool. B) Well, because I could. My talents? No clue, but I am sure they would have not passed the BRK stamp-of-approval. In fact, I would venture to say they were most likely random, *IF* I actually remembered to spend them before 3 levels went by.
I’m saying all this because I know a helluva lot more as a long-time level 70 raiding hunter (in part, thanks to BRK). But as a level 43, I could basically kill mobs by just looking at them, regardless of gear and talent choices. And as for just killing mobs my own level? I was annoyed when I had to waste my time on something that was not 3-4 levels above me. Getting my point yet?
All in, if us long-time level 70 raiding hunters rerolled another hunter, we would no doubt make *perfect* gear and talent decisions as we leveled. But where is the fun in that? The first time around, we all learned as we went and did our research as we needed along the way. And for me, that point didn’t come until I was in my mid-60s…simply because I didn’t need to. Having to seriously trap in 5-man instances gave me cause for alarm. As such, I did the necessary homework and found a plethora of resources at my fingertips that I used accordingly.
BRK, you admit you are struggling in arena. But you will learn, research, and adapt. And if you don’t? Well, that’s “okay” as well. Same applies to a newly leveling hunters. Please be respectful of that and not turn your blog into some self-righteous “when I was level 6 I could solo Hogger with a glass of water and a paperclip” dribble. I have too much respect for you, please don’t disappoint me now.
I’ll end this with another quote from the OP, “I’m not really that hard core, I like to take my time, wear what I like and do things for fun.” Nuff said. Leave him/her play their game as they see fit until such time they are impacting your own game play (or actually ask for advice), and the rest of us can do the same.
dear BRK:
i posted your post on this on my site as i have been a victim of ppl not understanding my help, due to lack of a “good delivery” so i posted this to help them understand that i am just trying to help and this is what one guy responded with…
” I like the response in that it helps other but making an example out of this hunter is not nice. I read the rant but at the end she asks for gear advice not spec advice.
Some people like to figure out what works on their own. Maybe they have not maxed the potential of the character or even scratched the surface but they want to make it on their own. I know my first ever toon (a now retired 60 Human rogue) I wanted no advice and I spent no time reading to try and improve his talents until I had made 60 and was working towards end game. I was still combat at 60 and doing end game dps far better than those who respeced to follow the masses and to top it all I did it on my own. Sure many points were wasted and many points should have been spent somewhere else but it was my own spec. (Oh, this toon was created 3 days after WoW originally released so 60 was the end for me.)
Unsolicited advice should be carefully given. No one wants to hear they do not know how to play. No one wants to hear they are spending $15 a month to be told how to play. Arrogance may not be the intended response but it comes across this way of you are not careful.
I think I play my Holy Priest very well. One day one of the best holy priests on the server was talking to me and suggested I might be able to tweak my spec to gain a little better healing power. He did not say I was playing my character wrong just that with a few changes I could be better and then he did the smartest thing - he asked me if I wanted to go over my spec with him before he just started shooting ideas out there. I agreed and I respec the way he suggested. Also, another thing he said was try this spec for a few weeks and if you do not see an improvement go back to the spec I had as my spec was not bad it just could be more efficient. Taking this approach with me he disarmed my immediate defensive responses. In the end I reworked my spec again and have half of the changes he suggested included and half my original spec as I find it helps me best.
Reading the post and the response the responder points out that a person giving advice needs to use some tact and not just beat them over the head with it but he/she does exactly the same thing when he/she goes over the point distribution. For a post this might work as no one needs to know the person being made an example of but face to face it might be best to ask if the person wants help. More so, when helping praise the person and suggest that this might work better. Never tell them they are wrong as no one wants to be wrong and never tell them you are right. You might think you are right but they do not need to be told that.
Basically, it comes down to if someone wants advice they will seek you out but if you want to give them advice, tread lightly or risk upsetting them. Try to improve them without them know it if you can. Do things like “you know when I was that level this really worked for me but you know everyone is different.” The person might ignore you or might move your direction. I rarely give criticism, I prefer to use positive reinforcement. If I do criticize I do it not to improve but because you have angered me with your play.
So remember even though you are not in a room with someone on the game they are people and have feelings and it is best to work with them than to work through them. ”
just thought you might like to see it.
I agree 100%, I had a guildie I was helping out in dustwallow, about the same lvl as me. I inspected his gear, and saw that it was all strength and spirit gear, also he never used his pet and his bow was 10 levels below him. I tried to be nice and help, saying simply “you know agil and stam are a hunters best friends right?” he replied with “oh, I’m a melee hunter” to that i just gave “…”. I wanted to go off on a rant but was told by the guild he was 12, so I backed off.
Discussions of being in Hawk rather than in Viper are irrelevant for a level 43 hunter–you don’t get Viper until 64, so you really will be spending a lot of the time you aren’t in Cheetah or Monkey (your utility aspects) in Hawk.
However, IAotH is STILL fairly useless as a grinding/leveling talent. Even at level 70, I have no need whatsoever of IAotH–not only because I’m usually in Viper, but because it almost never procs in fights shorter than thirty seconds, which is about the length of single-mob fights while grinding (at least level 70 mobs), or even group pulls in instances. Even in two- or three-minute fights (chaining a lot of mobs together while grinding, the Gauntlet of Flame in Shattered Halls, non-heroic mid-boss fights), it generally doesn’t prove its worth. The DPS boost on IAotH relies on a) the hunter being able to stand still while fighting to make the best use of the attack speed boost (and this doesn’t happen a lot while grinding) and b) the fight being long enough that the 15% chance kicks in and actually procs. If I absolutely MUST have that speed increase during a boss fight or while grinding things, I have Rapid Fire (on a 3m cooldown thanks to Rapid Killing) and an Abacus to give me the haste boost.
Although you have to take into account–for pathfinding and some of the other stuff–that the hunter in question probably hasn’t ever respeced in the life of her toon, or even knows that she can do it, and fairly cheaply, at her level.
Honestly, since she just got her mount, I’d be tempted to go for the speed increase from Animal Handler anyway. Spirit Bond may be serving her well at that level, since she’s probably still running into situations where a healer isn’t around to save her butt. BD may or may not be necessary depending on the pet she’s running with (i.e., whether or not it has a focus dump); I’d be tempted to drop two points in IRP, because that drops its cast time well below the time it might take for a mob to break out of a trap–and I have been in situations where being able to revive my pet and get it back into action on a final trapped mob is invaluable.
But yes. The thing I see here, BRK, is that you’re offering her a build as if you were building a tiny raiding hunter using only 34 points. Some of the talents you’re skipping over have a place in the life of a hunter who is doing mostly solo work and a little grouping as she levels. Maximum damage is trumped by utility while you’re still under level 60; even at 70, a grinding spec relies more heavily on survivability, pet survivability, mana efficiency, and being able to travel well than it does on sheer DPS.
Dude, I mean duuude. Whoa. That last bit of your post was totally rightious. (Aorchuntard shakes own head like an etchasketch) Ahhem, I mean, You make several very good points there Mr. BRK and I for one apprieciate them. Keep up the good work.
I can understand the intentions entirely. I think BRK has a very solid point. I think *his* delivery was a bit horrible.
Do we really think BRK would PM this lady and be this harsh? Seriously? He wants to make the game as much fun as possible for this player. He had mounds and mounds and mounds of knowledge about his class that is rivals ElitistJerks.com and TankSpot.com. I believe BRK was doing what he can to show this girl what might increase her *enjoyment* of the game. Every had a tank that can’t hold a mob? Do you think he likes being called a n00b and abandoned? That was me and it sucked hard. No explanation, no advice, nothing- How harsh can it be to receive a PM saying, “You seem to be having some problems holding aggro. I have a 70 warrior myself- Can I help you?”
Same thing is going on here. Think of the context of BRK’s character when things like this are posted.
+Str does indeed increase AP, so saying that it is worthless to hunters isn’t exactly true. Would I choose +STR over anything else? Not.
As far as I know, strength increases melee attack power for hunters, not ranged.
Strength does not increase RAP, no. But even if you’re a melee hunter, you’d want agility anyway, because agility is crit, dodge, and armor as well as melee AP. Hunters don’t get shields (durr), so the other benefit of strength (increasing damage blocked) never factors in. And, unlike melee classes, hunters only get 1 AP per point of strength.
Hi there, I’m the writer of the original post. As I do very much appreciate everyone’s input, it is a bit humbling to have my concerns go a little more public than originally planned but…
Considering that the last game I played before WoW was Viva Pinata, I’ve come a long way. I play WoW so that my husband and I can spend quality time together with something that we both enjoy. In the beginning, I was hesitant to purchase and play WoW due to the angst I felt when thinking of playing with a few million other people.
I guess the main feeling I had from the 70 hunter was that I was offended. The feeling would be the same I’m sure if some neighbor from my neighborhood that I’d never met before walked up to me in my yard and commented on how horrible my grass looked and here’s what you are supposed to do. Or better yet, a wrong number calling your home and without even saying hello, begin to tell you what things you are doing wrong with your life.
Everyone plays at their own pace, for their own reasons and geared towards their own goals. I don’t play to raid or get great loot. I’ve never been through an instance with anyone but my husband and I prefer to work alone if my husband’s not playing that day. I would never want to jeopardize anyone’s serious play with my lack of experience.
I feel that I play according to my own needs and happiness. I simply didn’t appreciate some stranger’s blunt opinion on my gaming. There have been many, many annoying pet peeves that I’ve adopted throughout playing WoW for the few months that I’ve played, but the rewards of spending time with my husband, leveling and having goals in a virtual realm have been worth the time, effort and biting of my tongue.
I may never have all the correct gear or stats, but I am more than happy with my advancements with such a neat game. I don’t have issues with learning from more experienced players, but tact from players is essential for me to accept that advice. I’m sure the 70 thought that he/she was only being helpful, but people have to understand that some people aren’t as hardcore or serious as others.
I do thank BRK for all his advice and expertise and I hope that I can apply the advice properly to make BRK proud.
Thanks to all and happy hunting!!
Original Post Chick,
I don’t think anyone should demand you change your ways. But I do think you should study the game a bit if you want to enjoy it in the future. Right now, it might be mostly an activity to have with your husband, or a super chatroom. But as you two continue to play, you will gain levels and see new content. You would have to try really hard NOT to gain levels in this game.
When you do, you will find to keep the game fun you will want to at least make an effort to learn what works. Talents? ya, they have their place, and some are better than others for what you are doing. But equipment is pretty much a mainstay for everyone as a whole. Agility is one of the bedrocks to the hunter class. Then there are other stats such as +AP, Stamina that will certainly help you out. Don’t dismiss the idea that you should study the game at least a minor bit, if you want to play it in the future. If you don’t, you are going to find at some point, the game will not be very much fun as you enter higher level content thru the natural progression of playing it.
best of luck,
PT
ARGH!! You people just won’t get it, and it is just about making me want to crawl out of my skin. I have been reading forums for close to 1 year now (including this site) and have yet to make a post. This is now my second, see above for my first.
I just want to say to Original Post Chick…continue as you are and don’t ever feel the need to defend your game play style to anyone. I thank you for being one of the first posts I’ve read in months that I find refreshing. You’re flawed, you know it, but you are where you want to be and having fun doing it. Best part? You won’t apologize for not parting your hair on the left side of your head every second Tuesday of the month. /Salute
I sincerely hope you continue to enjoy your game play, that’s what it’s all about. Experience WoW at your own pace. Make mistakes, learn from them, and then make some more! And if anyone ever has anything to say about it, simply let them know that *you* pay $15/mo to play a GAME and that you’ll do whatever the hell you want.
Now where did I put those Herod Shoulders of mine…
/kiss FWIW.
“And if anyone ever has anything to say about it, simply let them know that *you* pay $15/mo to play a GAME and that you’ll do whatever the hell you want.”
OMFG. Why don’t more people realize this? Every time I hear arguments in trade, or general chat or wherever about one person preaching to another about gear or spec, I usually end up telling the “preacher” to STFU until he starts paying the other guy’s $15 a month. Usually shuts them up too.
Ohhhh Kitty… my favorite, favorite Kitty! How I wish someone would perform this type of service for us shamans… and my new rogue! Such lovely, juicy, HELPFUL advice from a very seasoned veteran is something we could all use, especially yours truly. Unfortunately I don’t play a hunter, so I mostly read for fun, but yet I yearn for a BRK shammy… somewhere… out there?
Honestly, FWIW, I don’t care how other people play. XD But if someone wants to know how to improve their game, then I’ll say so. If not, then not, but I reserve the right to comment on their lack of knowledge if it becomes an issue.
IIRC, I’ve never told someone “hey your gear sucks” or “you should do this” unless they’ve asked me to.
If you are going to play exclusively with your husband then it doesn’t matter how you spec or gear up. But if you ever want to progress and play with guildies and friends at level 50+ doing instances and 4-5 person quests, then you *should* learn how to properly gear and spec your character to get the most benefit/output. This will also help everyone around you get more enjoyment as well (aka, being the cause of many party wipes). In a MMORPG game, people benefit from others (and sometimes suffer too hehe).
That said, if you don’t want to better yourself, then I would stop at level 40 and just keep making new alts with your hubby. I suspect your husband (unless he has your same views of playing for fun with no cares on being a better player) is probably going to want to see more content later on and you are going to drag him down if you don’t put time into getting better.
The most important part of this story is not about the correct gear and talent spec for a leveling hunter. It is not about how to accept help. I would much rather BRK had written an article titled How To Give Advice. I find more WoW players need that than “How to Accept Help.”
I think we all need to take a step back and get a little perspective here. Original Post Chick is playing WoW so she can spend time with her husband, doing something they both enjoy. If she gets to 70 and they start to enjoy end-game together, then she might need to worry about gear/spec choices affecting her play. Might.
This is a game. Enjoy it. How many of us wish we had a wife who enjoyed playing with us. That would make my day, every day.
In the creative fields I’ve worked in, we utilize a little technique called “Constructive Criticism”. It’s simple, really. You start off by telling the person who is being critiqued something good about their work. Then, you honestly and respectfully dig in to what needs work and then finish up by pointing out something good.
For example.
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BRK, this was a very interesting choice of topic from which to make a post. Lots of people have no idea what to do in this game when beginning and this post should help people in how to give advice to newer players and receive advice from veteran players. Keeping the post anonymous was a good choice.
However, the overly detailed critique of the spec itself and the borderline condescending tone undermine the credibility of the post somewhat. Choosing a hypothetical situation over a real situation might have been a more productive choice and lends itself more to your tongue in cheek writing style.
The detailed examination of the spec derailed the focus of the piece somewhat. Staying focused on the more important issue of the how, when and why of offering advice would have given the post a great deal more weight.
All that said, you wrap up the the article nicely bringing everything full circle and emphasizing the core points in the beginning of the post. Definitely a valuable post.
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Start with something positive, offer up your advice, close with something positive. Works like a charm.
BRK, you know I (we) love you, but I couldn’t support the ‘pelides’ more whole-heartedly.
Original Post Chick, when I was level 43 I would shoot a couple of times, and finish off the mob with my sword. Heck, If a mob takes a swing at me now I am overly critical of my game play. As BRK states I should put out Massive Quantatied of Sustained Ranged Damage Per Second (MQoSRDPS). My axe is for looks and stats, not use (barring rare situations).
At some point in our lives each one of us knew nothing of WoW. We knew nothing of the classes, the gear, the game mechanics, etc. We all learned. We all were critisized. We all have been praised for out skills. We all have a different pace of play.
Also, I think I would just like to add that it is extremely important to remember, no matter what level a person is at, that there is a flesh and blood person behind the controls of the WoW character. I think we get so caught up with the specs, goals, gold and status, that we tend to forget that the human being behind the ‘toon has feelings, is unique and may be driven to play virtual games for many different reasons.
Of course I can appreciate ‘help’ and ‘advice’, but in truth, a lot of the elaborate nature of the game bores me. I enjoy Blizzard’s creativity and style the most. Sometimes I pause while running through the jungle to look at the beautiful waterfall or marvel at the vast colors of the trees in Ashenvale.
Being a mother of two, one under two years old, I also have responsibilities that take me away from the helm of the computer often, so I tend to shy away from instances or anything where I cannot AFK for any length of time. I don’t like waiting so I never expect anyone to wait for me.
My husband also has a higher level mage whom he plays exclusively with his more serious guild mates and friends. So if he feels the need for more challenge, he’s more than supported with more serious players. If he’s playing that character, I simply do something else with my girl. Shopping at the auction, farming for spider’s silk or running to get new flight points are some of my favorites.
I enjoy making gold, it’s a rewarding accomplishment to at least have a lot of money in fantasy.
I will get to 70, I have no doubt at all about that. I do however, think, depending on the time constraints of raiding and instances, that I may not strive to conquer the Outlands. I already have plans of rolling a new character and leveling them to 70. I don’t often finish many projects, so this is quite the feat that WoW has kept my interest this long.
So, in closing, I dinged 45 last with my hunter. To date, I’ve only had to have my Shaman husband resurrect me once and I love having my ghostsabre running beside me like a loyal sidekick.
In the end, it is only a game, but I find it interesting the many aspects of people’s personalities that appear while playing a fictional character. Some are more outgoing and flirtatious while wearing the WoW mask and others are more aggressive and competitive than their submissive ‘real’ selves. Great psychological fodder really.
Take care all
C:
As a hunter and a member of the wow_ladies community, I feel as if you’re missing the point BRK and by rebroadcasting this players post without her permission, I”m assuming, to begin with is making you look somewhat worse than the original offender.
Many players, whether you like it or not, are in no way interested in being told whether or not they’ve spent their talent points correctly or have such and such gear. Not everybody raids, not everybody pvps. In the end it’s a game that suscribers pay for and they are perfectly allowed to do as they wish.
If that player decides that they want to get more heavily into the game then is the time to offer helpful suggestions when the time is right and not by *cough* strangers.
She then posted her concerns in a community and asked for advice from that communities members… not you.
Wow_ladies has often been the subject of many other blogs, without permission to quote, and has had certain… persons join the community and view locked posts who are not ladies, and then repost that content and comment on it. It’s a community for women to discuss their Wacraft concerns and experiences and it’s not much appriciated when non community members broadcast their two cents in other public forums. The community is more about companionship and helpful information when asked by women who play WoW, not about shoving down throats.
IMOP mind your own business.
Any conversation like this that doesn’t start with “would you like some advice?” or similar, is rude. That goes for you too BRK.
And if the answer is, “no, thanks”, move on.
Thank You Kindly,
Corwyn
A WoW Lady, I understand that this BRK post has irritated you. I must, however, let you know that BRK has been nothing but respectful toward your posters and your site.
This particular post may not be his shining moment to back up my prior statement, but it is an anomoly.
Look through all of BRK’s posts, and you’ll have trouble seeing as many negative comments as are on this one.
His intentions, I’m sure, were pure. The delivery could have used a bit of polishing.
A ghost kid,
I’m merely a member of this community and do not represent the whole. I am also an avid reader of BRK as a hunter and often respect his opinon. It’s a given that this is his blog and he is allowed to broadcast the information and experience he has gained. Given that, he has brought possible unwanted attention to a community member and made her easily found.
If BRK gave it some thought, I believe that he would realize that though the original offender may have offered sound adivce, he was in no place to give it, and that advice offered from strangers in the game holds about as much weight as a feather. Unless this guy was a class leader or guild master, even then, he could have given her some terrible advice.
Her spec is not THAT bad, she’s leveling BM and learning, and learning by doing is the best way. Gear while leveling is not as important as it used to be, as leveling has become much easier, faster, and gear replacements come swiftly.
Point being, in my opinion, the guy had no right or place to say anything to her. She became concered, and asked a community what their opinon was about the gear and the situation. She did not ask BRK for his opinon.
The ironic thing regarding all the advice, is that I’m probably going to read the advice, apply ’some’ of it, but ultimately I’m going to do whatever strikes my fancy. If a pair of leggings have more agility than another but their ugly as heck on, I’m gonna pick a nicer looking pair. Yah, it’s a girl thing.
But…one thing that I have learned and I will never do is offer unsolicited advice to someone who has not asked or after I hit 70, imply in any way that I am superior to any level below me.
I find such an odd stigma and ego attached to WoW. It actually startled me in the beginning how aggressive and impolite some players could be. I’m quite surprised how very ‘high school’ some guilds can behave. Even from just reading posts in forums and having some of my own upsetting experiences with a few members, I’m literally appalled how some treat others.
It saddens me that in this day and age, where we strive to be better people, we still have the compulsion to belittle and think that we are ‘better than’ another. Even if it’s only in the game, it shows a lack of compassion and consideration to ignore or treat others lesser due to their level or lack of experience.
Being that I’m a newbie gamer, I’ll try to take the upsetting moments with a grain of salt, but I cannot deny that some remarks or treatment from others has not brought a lump to my throat. It is rather shocking to those who have never played online before. Like I said before, my gaming abilities were limited to Viva Pinata and Mario. WoW was a huge step for me.
I do enjoy the game, but I sure don’t enjoy the politics. Of course, I’m the original ‘let’s all just get along’ person, but wow, is that difficult sometimes with 10 million other players!!
I thank WoW_Ladies for giving me a safe place to vent and share happy moments and the not so happy moments of WoW.
But…one thing that I have learned and I will never do is offer unsolicited advice to someone who has not asked or after I hit 70, imply in any way that I am superior to any level below me.
I was on my new rogue in Blasted Lands yesterday killing endless amounts of vultures for their gizzards which never seemed to drop. I noticed there was this one level 53 hunter who was meleeing everything in the zone and his pet just stood at his side.
I really felt sorry for the guy, so I introduced myself and said I have a level 70 hunter and have been playing for three years. He said, “Hey. How’s it going?”
I broke the ice with him and approached him as a regular person. I then asked him if he was having some trouble as I didn’t see him using his pet. He said he saw no point in using the pet because the pet couldn’t hold aggro against him.
Then I asked him if I could offer up some advice. He said he could some help. So, I walked him through pet-grind-tanking 101, pointed him toward Omen and this site. I watched him do this a couple more times and he got the hang of it. Now he was shooting at range and the pet was tanking.
I went back to my roguing and swearing at the vultures for being so stingy with their gizzards. Half hour later, the guy whispers me.
Him: “Uh. Is it really supposed to be this easy to kill stuff as a hunter?”
Me: “Well, when everything is 3-4 levels below you, definitely. Head out to the Plaguelands and Winterspring and things will get harder but with some persistence, you could be taking on mobs 3-4 levels higher than you. It’s the beauty of leveling a hunter.”
Him: “Thanks so much for the help!”
You can help someone out if you see they’re struggling. In order for it to register, you need to approach the person behind the computer screen. If you show them the respect they deserve and make it known that you are only trying to share your hard earned experience, people will gladly listen. If you share experience rather than authority, people will listen.
The trick is to treat people like people…. not lower level toons.
Lot of good comments so far, leaving me only one to make.
“Fun” and “as combat-effective as possible” are not always the same thing. There are more ways to have fun with WoW than just min/maxing your characters. Someone else’s choices may not measure up in your eyes… but then, they don’t have to.
Pfft, NO spec/talent distribution at that level is THAT bad. If you are able to kill said mob standing in front of you, mission accomplished.
What really got me was:
_____________________________________________________
“Dude, I ran this 43 hunter in Pax Vobiscum through some quests, what a mess. How can they let her remain ignorant? Why aren’t they helping her? What’s wrong with Pax Vobiscum?”
And don’t think this doesn’t happen, either.
_____________________________________________________
I mean, really. You do realize we are talking about Arathi Highlands and not SSC, correct? BRK’s lack of perspective, pettiness, and condescension with his post continues to amaze me.
Perhaps BRK needs some advice from his own community? Take a break…one long enough for you to get over yourself.
Well, I do have a compromise, if BRK truly feels that everything with my specs are wrong and my gear is crappy. I would be more than happy for him to run me through some cool instances to get the gear I need and some gold to unlearn my current specs would be super cool. C:
BRK, I appreciate that you offered a lot of great information in this post…but I do question your reposting someone’s post. Did you contact the OP for consent? I understand that legally it is fair use, but I find it a little ethically questionable to repost something intended for a small audience to a much larger one without consent.
I find it a little ironic that you decided to offer her even more unsolicited advice. She is being far more gracious than I’d be!
And OP Chick, rock on! This is supposed to be about fun, and you get that! There is a big difference between advice offered out of generosity and kindness, and “advice” offered as an opportunity to show off. Someone truly seeking to help you will respect your deciding not to accept that help.
@FWIW
This is exactly what I have been talking about. Offering advice, whether it’s on someone’s spec or on someone’s blog post should be constructive. Telling BRK to “Take a break…one long enough for you to get over yourself.” is hardly constructive.
While your point about Arathi Basin vs. SSC is valid, you need to realize that BRK is just trying to help hunters level more successfully, though the tone and manner in which this post went about it was a little off target.
Attacking the character of the blog poster is of very little use. Attack the argument, not the person.
Another thing would be to give advice in whispers, not in party chat “in front of everybody”. In whispers is at least private, in party chat serves no purpose but to humiliate the person.
“I suspect your husband (unless he has your same views of playing for fun ***with no cares on being a better player***) is probably going to want to see more content later on and ***you are going to drag him down*** if you don’t put time into getting better.”
Wow. Condescension FTL.
One more thing is that having a good grinding / soloing spec while leveling DOES make the game more fun and enjoyable, even for the most casual player. No matter what, having a spec that helps you rather than hinders you, will make the game more fun, and make you want to stay around more. Imagine the frustration of everyone who rolls warriors and priests as their first character, and often starts leveling as protection or holy. They grind away in futility and think “god what an annoying game”.
A more casual player is even more in need of advice since they might not go read a bunch of forums. And pretty much the biggest area of help many new players need is in their spec. Giving advice to strangers is a different issue. But saying “casual players don’t need advice since they don’t care as much” is silly. Since think about it this way: dying, taking forever to kill monsters, having everything be harder for you, is not fun.
It’s not about “performance” or forcing things on people, it’s about helping them get more enjoyment out of the game.
I mainly give my real-life friends advice, not strangers, and my one friend after he respecced told me how much more he liked his rogue. He was ready to quit and I didn’t even know how frustrated he was.
I should know that was my first character I played up until 50. And it was so much easier once I read up and changed. I started having much more fun. I still played casually, for fun, I didn’t care about performance, but killing things faster, not dying as much, spending more time playing, yes, that is more fun.
@pelides
Yes, I will agree with you; however, BRK never made his post under a hypothetical situation. It was a copy and paste of a real post, made by a real person. Even the real guild name was included.
And given his “tone”….THAT, my friend, was most definitely “personal” whether it was intended to be or not.
I did pause before making that comment, and honestly, I just didn’t know any other way to say it.
I did notice an odd coincidence there as well FWIW. Considering recent posts on BRK. Very interesting indeed. Seems high school attitudes loom forever.
Wow, way to make me wish I hadn’t endorsed your site. Sorry.. just… wow.
Okay, I think now would be a great time for everyone to step back and take a breath.
Perhaps if Original is offended, BRK should send her an apology and let it all move on. I am not sure what is the offense more, the constructive critism or the posting, at this point.
Play how you want to play. Enjoy the game how you want to enjoy the game. Everyone is entitled to that.
Best wishes
PT
I like the sounds of that. An apology would certainly put my mind at ease.
At the moment I’m feeling rather relieved that I decided against PvP, I may have been corpse camped for life!!
Hmmm…considering this big mess and publicity, any suggestions as to what my ‘new’ character class should be, hehe.
@OP Chick
I hope all of this doesn’t turn you off of the hunter class. I’ve played one for 3 years and still love playing him. Granted, until recently, I played fairly seriously and spec’d/geared him for end game content, but he’s so much fun to play. Honestly, I’d say the class is more fun out “in the wild” where you can really push the limits of what the class can do. In raids, the fun is really in the teamwork of getting 10 or 25 people to act like a unit with one goal… a dead boss.
I’m leveling a rogue right now (lvl 53) and am having a blast at it! It’s been so long now since I experienced the old content that I’m actually having fun at it again.
When it comes down to it there are only a few types of players. Those who enjoy the social aspect of it, those who enjoy leveling alts and experiencing the content from different perspectives/game mechanics, those who enjoy the challenges afforded in group play and those who desire to be trailblazers and experience content before anyone else. It’s your $15/mo and it’s your prerogative to experience the game as you see fit and it seems you tend to enjoy the social aspect of the game above the others. That’s great!
Don’t let this extended little flame session ruin anything for you. BRK is a very tongue-in-cheek blogger, but his goals and intentions are noble. And he’s human like the rest of us and sometimes what we say and what we mean don’t necessarily line up perfectly. I’d take this post in the spirit it was intended, as friendly advice. Take from it what works for you and ignore what doesn’t.
So really what everyone is trying to say here is that BRK should’ve done what he’s done before and ripped out all the identifying details, including the Armory link, and edited the original post until it was not pointing to any specific person. Not mentioning the post was on WoW Ladies would’ve been good, too–so no one could go back and track down the individual in question.
Why he didn’t do this this time is beyond me, given he’s been relatively circumspect about anonymity before. But the level of response to this is feeding off itself and building into internet hysteria on both sides. The “just play the game the way you want to” argument looks more morally defensible on the surface, but seriously–that someone has violated this unspoken “rule” is definitely not on par with, say, admitting at a polite party that you actually enjoy abusing children. The level of response and dismay attached to people’s responses here seems overblown from where I’m standing.
Me, I’m just here for the mechanics discussion. No offense, OPC. c: Keep playing a hunter! They’re the easiest class, IMO, to just play for fun. That they can become ridiculously powerful endgame is a nice bonus, but some of the most fun I’ve had with my hunters has been doing things I’m not supposed to do, like tanking Sunken Temple.
“…but some of the most fun I’ve had with my hunters has been doing things I’m not supposed to do, like tanking Sunken Temple.”
WORD!
Think everyone’s bent a little outta shape on this post. Just wanted to put my comment on the wall to let BRK know I liked the article.
…still wish you did a Warrior version, though
I wish somone would have tought me some theorycrafting basics before level 70 my first time around. Leveling the second time was much easier.
The best part about tanking ST was I had a ret paly healing me.
I loved it.
Wow. This has got to be one of the most tactless things I’ve seen in a while.
Did you even stop to think that this post might be potentially humiliating for the OP in question? That your “advice” might come off as overbearing and high-handed?
I’m sorry, but while you do Know Your Specs, you fail miserably at basic courtesy and consideration.
There were several better ways to have handled posting this as a topic to your blog, and I’m at an utter loss to understand why someone so intelligent would have been so very, very clumsy about it.
First, nobody bothered to do a talent-spec analysis.
I think you missed the point of her post. She was upset by getting unsolicited advice, and only asked us to give her advice on her GEAR, not her spec. I don’t know about you, but when someone is upset over getting unwanted advice…you don’t go “Let me shove some more unwanted advice down your throat.” Seriously.
And at least she put all of her points in somewhere useful, rather than doing the wonderful thing I see constantly of having 10 points in every tree at level 40. THAT would have been cringe-worthy, this spec was just her experimenting and trying her own thing out. It’s always better for someone to learn which spec suits them the best rather than have it spoon-fed to them.
“It’s always better for someone to learn which spec suits them the best rather than have it spoon-fed to them.”
You can’t be serious.
All of your specs are ones you found on your own without looking or asking for any advice?
No. Way.
@Stupid Mage
I never said don’t ask for advice, I’m just against getting spoon-fed specs without trying some things out for yourself. It’s easy to copy-paste a spec, but it does little good if you don’t know how to play it.
Some people like being spoon-fed, some don’t. *shrugs* I have a BRK cookie-cutter BM spec, which I settled on from my own experience as a Hunter, not because he recommended it. I learned through trial-and-error while leveling up which talents were useless for me, and which I loved, and I personally feel I learned the class a whole lot better than someone who mindlessly plugged it in to their character.
I’m a member of WoWladies, and I’ve been a bit disturbed by the use of our community to provide fodder for other people’s blogs. The post was made asking for gear advice and how to deal with people trying to shove advice down her throat.
We helped with that.
BRK promptly decided to rip into the OP, for her spec, and her desire to simply enjoy the game. Thank you for doing this, for doing exactly what she was complaining about, because it’s just so helpful. Yes, it’s so helpful you decided to basically mock someone for enjoying herself and giving her that unwanted advice.
An Apology to her, both on your blog as it’s own post and on the WoWLadies would be the gentleman thing to do, but as it’s also polite to not rip someone to shreds over enjoyment of a game….
I would also like to see a response from BRK. And I don’t think this has been over-blown at all.
We are guessing as to what BRK’s intention was when writing this. While some of us have given him the benefit of the doubt, I am simply not prepared to do that until I read a public response from him.
Ignoring the responses from your readers will only give us the answer. So, please, put an end to all this and do the “right” thing. We would all appreciate it.
I am so completely overwhelmed and touched by everyone, I truly thank you all from the bottom of my heart. This experience has truly shown me a sense of community within WoW_Ladies and I’m surely proud to be a part of it. C:
I personally hope that I myself did not offend anyone, especially the 70 Hunter who I’m sure meant no real malice in their remarks. By venting within WoW_Ladies, I merely was attempting to make sure myself, my husband and the guild did not have to be embarrassed by any obvious flaws in my gaming that I may not have been aware of.
I have learned a vast amount of knowledge today, of which I will attempt to apply in respect to those who are more experienced and whom have respected me in return. I think, however, that BRK may have learned the bulk of the lessons offered today. One being that WoW_Ladies is a force not to be taken lightly and two, that gamers should respect one another at all levels.
I do hope that BRK responds to put us all at ease with all that has transpired.
I promise to forgive him completely…if he helps me buy my epic mount when I get to 70. C;
Um ok back to the issue of +agi gear. A poster from Drenden way back mentioned that the AH prices on that server run about 10 Gold for 50ish greens. During a random check of the Fenris AH last night, the mail chest armor (with +agi) between lvl 37 and lvl 60, averaged about 45 Gold (starting bid). So idk if it’s the Gold Sellers/Gold Buyers or greedy lvl 70s or what but prices of +agi gear on some servers is crazy. Or it may be tied to oil prices somehow. So please don’t criticize hunters that do’nt have gobs of +agi. I doubt many of the now lvl 70 players payed those prices during their lower levels.
/annoyed
I’ve been reading this blog for a long time now, and I’m willing to give BRK the benefit of the doubt here as I can’t recall him ever being a true @$$hat. I think the nature of this post has been lost amongst the many comments. Before I explain, I have to say that copying a post into the blog wasn’t the most tactful move ever, and a hypothetical letter based on the original might have caused less uproar.
I’ve read this post several times now, and while the post is entitled “how to accept help,” If you read it carefully, it is not focused on the original poster (who is more than welcome to play any way she wants to), as it is on the advice she was given, and randomly advice given in general. The poster did ask what they were doing so wrong, and while BRK would have been wise to again not use the original poster as an example, he is simply pointing out advice that he believes should have been included on the original post’s replies, based on the questions asked.
His second concern was of the statement that the clothing choice was affecting no-one. He was spot on with his answer, and again, simply pointing out that the statement was false while using supporting evidence. Everything he said in that section was true, but he also goes on to say that advice doesn’t has to be listened to. He simply suggests that before dismissing advice, you at least try and determine the motive of the advice giver. He points out that most people don’t try to help because they think they are superior, and if you’ve read any of his posts on PvP, you’ll know that he doesn’t ascribe to a superior attitude. If you read the original post on this blog, it paints a clear picture of why it exists, and BRK’s attitude.
Should BRK appologize for using the original post here? I not only say yes, I know he will, because in reading this blog, I have seen a kind person who only wants to help the hunter community and wow players in general. But do I believe that main idea of this post is a public flogging of the original poster, No I do not.
And OPC, personally, I think you’d have more fun with some of those tweaks, but if not, enjoy the game your way, and ignore anything you want to. It’s your choice, and I not only respect that, I applaud you for doing your own thing. I love playing the game with my wife, and I hope your husband is having as much fun playing with you.
- SamuelTempus
BRK, i followed your site and your advice while my lil hunter was BM spec. I still looked at your site after I respec’ed her to MM/SV.
now I’m livid at your insensitivity. You were out of line, mister.
You owe someone an apology.
Now apologize and stay out of our community, PLZKTX.
I remain standing by overblown.
Especially because OPC’s responses have gone from something along the line of “hey, wow, BRK noticed me and this is a pretty cool blog, although I’m still kinda upset at that other dude” to “I want an apology, and everyone who’s come in here and been offended on my behalf is wonderful”. (NOTE: THIS IS HEAVILY PARAPHRASED AND AN INTERPRETATION FROM THIS READER’S POINT OF VIEW. IT IS NOT MEANT TO REFLECT ANY ACTUAL DISCUSSION THAT HAS OCCURRED OR MAKE ANY ASSUMPTIONS ABOUT WHAT OTHER PEOPLE ARE THINKING OR SAYING. Disclaimer written in all caps ‘cuz people often miss it.)
I am not saying anything about OPC’s motives or those of anyone from WoW Ladies. But this kind of behavior–where someone’s offended on someone else’s behalf, leading to the original someone else (who may not have been particularly offended at all) suddenly becoming offended–is self-sustaining, and can turn into some really nasty invective getting thrown around. Some of the huffiness has already blossomed into full-on community-defense aggression, and it’s ugly to watch.
Anyhow. People should go read SamuelTempus’s response, it’s cool.
I will also say, however, that despite being a lady (well, woman, girl maybe) that’s into WoW, this has made me disinclined to dust off my Livejournal and join the community. Sorry, ladies; I may disagree with BRK on a number of things, but that a potential ally has been recast so readily as an enemy makes me uneasy about the community that does it.
I think people have to take about ten steps back and re-read BRKs article.
But I’m a Stupid Mage so probably missed the whole point of it.
@Ansawa - I agree 100%! I think some of the replies to this post have been as egostical and condesending as they accuse BRK of being. BRK’s commentary was dead on - the original critique from the level 70 guildy was tactless, but still had merit. You can play at your own pace and with your own style, but it does start affecting others when you group up or represent a guild. If you want to play at less than your class’/race’s maximum ability, then do it solo or with others that share that same attitude. When you group with others or join a guild, your should be expected to meet a generally accepted standard of performance. You know, like if I want to get up at 10am and quit doing serious work at 2pm, that is my prerogative, but it ain’t gonna cut it in the real world… In fact, those that join a group ill-prepared (e.g., poorly geared, poorly specced, unrepaired, lacking consumables, etc.) are just as guilty as those that offer unsolicated, inconsiderate advice!
Throughout the history of this site, BRK has been fair, considerate and knowledgeable. His intentions were clearly to point out that even under less than ideal conditions, players can learn from more experienced members of the community. Even if you are treated tactlessly, rudely, @sshatly (I’m pretty sure I saw that in Webster’s - look it up!), you may want to steo back and evaluate your own performance.
Hey, I can certainly be a noob with the best (worst?) of them. I play the game casually. I have never taken a toon to 70 (maxed at 59, although I suffer from extreme altitis - at least 7 or 8 toons around 25-35, plus a terminal case of loving the BGs). I don’t usually enjoy grouping with anyone but RL friends. I solo almost all of my grinding/leveling. But I still want to be a *good* player. Sure, I want to have fun on my own, but I certainly have more fun when I am killing more and dying less.
And I truly think that was BRK’s point. Even when playing casually, and even when you are not theorycrafting to death, most people have more fun when they are being the best they can be. Try to ignore the @sshats, and think about what you are doing and why. And please, do not decry those (such as BRK) that are trying to thoughtfully help the community.
To all those demanding that BRK issue a public apology - seriously? You people are just as bad as the level 70 that told the original poster that their gear sucked (and for the record - if it was all +str on a hunter? it DID suck). “Hey BRK, your post sucks. You must apologize.” See? Just as rude…
Wait…crap…what Stupid Mage said in so many fewer words…ACK..UGH..YIKES………!
Please BRK, do NOT apologize! You are correct!
To those that accuse BRK of revealing too much information - uh, what?! There is no toon name. There is no guild name (even though some *claim* that there is…). The only revealing mention is that the original post was on Wow Ladies. I just looked on Wow Ladies - I did NOT see the original post. Now certainly I am lazy and did not do a complete search, but on quick perusal, there is no obvious sign of the original post. BRK owes absolutely no apology.
Yes, Malgato makes a good point–just as OPC has every right to play the game her own way, that will not stop people, BRK included, from exercising their equally valid right to criticize her if they so choose–provided it doesn’t turn into harassment.
And, as I said before, this is a far cry from harassment. ;P And I was wrong–even if he kept the post whole cloth, he did take out the Armory link and any other identifying information. I’m pretty sure the guild name mentioned? Is a made-up guild, and people crying foul can go on and check that if they wish to actually put some weight behind the accusation.
Let this also be a lesson in “if you don’t want the public to read and repeat it, don’t make it a public post”.
“I have learned a vast amount of knowledge today, of which I will attempt to apply in respect to those who are more experienced and whom have respected me in return. I think, however, that BRK may have learned the bulk of the lessons offered today. One being that WoW_Ladies is a force not to be taken lightly and two, that gamers should respect one another at all levels.
I do hope that BRK responds to put us all at ease with all that has transpired.
I promise to forgive him completely…if he helps me buy my epic mount when I get to 70. C;” -posted by Original Post Chick
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Okay, now you are appearing quite foolish.
You and your WoWLadies cronies made your points……several times……each.
“Improved Pathfinding is another honkin’ No.”
> Not necessarly, leveling up one of the most annoying things is how slowly you move about, running sucks. So she might have got these talents for that. However as she has reached 40 and probably got a mount then they can probably be dropped. But pre 40 this can be quite nice. If you find getting from place to place to be fustratingly slow, then this talent can ease your pain alittle.<
Exactly what I was thinking. This was an interesting read.
To Mrs. BRK,
Thanks for the smile this morning
My husband races mini-stock race cars, and he’s very passionate about it…so passionate that I still have a hole in my living room ceiling where his big foot went through it over a year ago. So I totally understand the point of view of the wife with the honey-do list that never gets completed due to the spouses love of a hobby.
Oh, and he doesn’t say a word about my WoW playing
To the members of the WoWLadies community…simmer down. Ya’ll are making yer’selves look foolish at this point.
Regards,
Karamia
I do agree that it’s someone’s 15.00 a month and they should be able to use their time however they please. If they want to solo in brewfest clothes with no pet and a throwing weapon, that is awesome.
Until they do an instance.
Now, it is still their 15.00 monthly fee, but it’s the group’s 60.00 a month. So when an incompetent person does an instance, they are ruining the experience for four other people.
Remember that when you’re grouped, you have 4-24 people depending on your to have at least a fundamental knowledge of what to do, be it threat-checked dps, crowd control, healing, or tanking. If you’re not performing competently, you’re like the annoying cousin who “forgot” to bring green bean casserole to the pot luck thanksgiving but wants to eat the turkey anyway.
Honestly I’m quite surprised at the ferocity people have shown in defending ignorance.
Baseball, with all due respect, the OP never mentioned anything about instancing. What she did mention was helping a guildie finish quests in Arathi. She (a 43 hunter), a lvl 70 AND o