We Brave More Insults
WooT for LooT! Dragon Slayer’s Sabatons and Pendant of the Outcast Hero
With the acquisition of these items, our Hit Rating was too low for the content we’re running. How do we know? WATCH. /grump
If the enemy you’re fighting as a hunter has a Defense Rating no more than ten points higher than your Weapon Skill Rating, the following is the formula we use to calculate the Miss Chance:
Miss% = 5 + [ ( Defensive Skill - Weapons Skill ) * 0.1 ]
If the enemy you’re fighting as a hunter has a Defense Rating more than ten points higher than your Weapons Skill Rating, this is the forumla we use to calculate the Miss Chance:
Miss% = 7 + [ ( Defensive Skill - Weapon Skill - 10 ) * 0.4 ]
If one is running Naxxramas, or other content where level 83 mobs are found, one would use the latter equation to calculate one’s Miss Chance because, since everybody gets five Defensive Skill points per level, these level 83 bosses have a Defensive Skill rating of 415 and our gun Weapon Skill is 400. So if we were running Naxx, our Miss Chance would be:
Miss% = 7 + [ ( 415 - 400 - 10 ) * 0.4 ] = 7 + 2 = 9%
At level 80, a hunter requires 32.79 Hit Rating points to achieve an additional 1% chance to Hit. So for us to get an extra 9% to Hit, we would need:
9 * 32.79 = 295.11 or a Hit Rating of 296.
But we’re not running Naxx. We’re not fighting level 83 mobs. Since we’re fighting in nothing but heroics, the highest level mob we’ll face is 82. Thus, our chance to Miss is calculated using the former formula:
Miss% = 5 + [ ( 410 - 400 ) * 0.1 ] = 5 + 1 = 6%
At level 80, a hunter requires 32.79 Hit Rating points to achieve an additional 1% chance to Hit. So for us to get an extra 6% to Hit, we need:
6 * 32.79 = 196.74 or a Hit Rating of 197.
For running heroic instances, not raids, our Hit Cap is 197; anything higher than 197 is a waste. This number can be adjusted down if we take points in the Careful Aim talent, or if we were running with a Draenai, or if we ate Hit-food, etc.
Our Hit Rating dropped precipitously when we equipped our two new pieces of gear. To compensate and get our Hit Rating up higher, we went out and bought two very nice weapons that have wonderful stats: Agility, Stamina, Attack Power, and Hit Rating:
Yes, we now own two Fang of Truth.
Now one just can’t run amok with dual-melee weapons without agility enchants, can we? No way; we have a reputation to maintain. Each sword received the new +26 Exceptional Agility enchant.
Cost? 750 gold for the mats, foshizzle.
Now then. Is our Hit Rating exactly 197? No, it’s actually 167. Are we Hit-Capped? No. Are we going to Miss occasionally? Perhaps, but we just completed three heroics and didn’t miss once. We’re in no rush to adjust it higher.
But let’s say we miss one time per boss fight. Is that optimum? No. Is it acceptable? Sure it is. Sheesh! We just blew 1000 gold on enchants and gems and gear to get our Hit Rating closer to where we need it to be, we don’t need to get crazier with our gold just to make up twenty more Hit Rating points. If we miss once per boss fight, that’s not the end of Azeroth as we know it.
We’re running heroics with our Spirit Beast, even though his DPS is below that of Hobbes, (thanks to a screwed up combination of the Longevity talent and our pet’s Spirit Strike.) But Loquenahak — we gave him his original name back ’cause it seemed fitting — has topped 1100 DPS on some of the boss fights we’re done.
We’re doing just fine with our “broken” pet and “substandard” Hit Rating.
And you can too.
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41% of damage done… Dang.
167? We are running with 179 and we’re 75 and still in our T4/ZA gear. Yeah we know it was high for that content, but we had a lucky loot spree right before WotLK. 167 just seems very low for for level 80. Does the 80 gear have less Hit?
Nice DPS.
How much haste have you got, and what would you gem for, supposing there were sockets in the Northrend gear so that my Jewelcrafting is not completely useless?
I don’t know…I still say the Stam isn’t worth it on the weapons over the extra agility and AP on the Slicers…I’m always the last one to die in the heroics I run unless I do something stupid…and then the extra 600ish HP isn’t going to make a difference. If you feel it does, it’s your character…just not the way I run.
In one item it may not make a difference. But if one practices Balance with all gear decisions, one will not create a weakness. 660 health here, 240 health there, it adds up. Glass-cannon is fine, except when it’s not.
We have a 170 haste rating, which is 5.18% haste. We do not seek out haste, since as a BM hunter, we’ve already been hasted 20% with Serpents Swiftness.
As for gems, we are particularly enjoying the +6Agi/+6Hit gems that are easily made by our guild JC, the raw gem costing less than 10g each.
i need to figure out what I do wrong…I know I’m not as equipped as many of you guys, but with dragonhawk on in instances I’m somewhere in the 2500-2600 AP range, 17% crit (i I know that’s a bit low) and 130 hit (before i get motw because my tank is almost always a druid). I just dinged 79 – but on a perfect run (like, if my shammy is there, I have my cat and I’m not concentrating on off-tanking anything) I am 1000-1050dps combined. I have 2x fang of truth (with +30 int on each) and the nessingwary quest gun. I am usually spamming steady shot, which is what has been mentioned so often here as the best for overall dps, and if I have to regain mana I start throwing in some arcanes and a normal (re: non-perfect) has me more in the 800-900dps.
Maybe I don’t use trinkets often enough- but I still can’t see how I am only at 40-45% of the dps you guys put out – particularly when you haven’t started compiling the raiding gear…more research for me, I guess.
oops, I meant 2250 AP and 17% crit before MotW
Is it acceptable? Sure it is.
And I guess this is where our ideology differs, because I vehemently disagree.
Then again, I got my raiding education in an environment where one missed shot (specifically a Tranq) could mean wiping my raid.
And I already mentioned that you only needed 196 for heroics. -_-;
Is it acceptable? Sure it is.
Well, the truth is, if you only run heroics, yeah, it sure is. Especially in WotLK ones which are SO forgiving. But in a raid it is completely the other way around. You see, a chance is not a solid number. You may miss one or no shots, but you may miss a series of 3-4 shots. And you can’t put too much in luck. And -as Rilgon said- you can’t predict what you will miss. If you miss the opening MD shot you may wipe the raid. If you miss a Tranq and don’t dispel what you are supposed to dispel, you wipe the raid. And we hunters have a very bad reputation already, we can’t afford to make it worse
Keep it up
You shoulda gone for +25 Crit +25 Hit on each weapon.
Out of interest BRK: in preaching about balance why have you spent 1k gold on “balanced” weapons (which i dont agree with btw but thats not the issue) and then gone for a +15 damage scope over the new crit one (which only goes for about 120g on most servers) when crit is what a hunter so badly needs at this gear level?
I could understand if you were on say 33% crit and being raidbuffed to 40% but i kindof seems crazy to talk about balance then do that lol.
BRK,
Your current weapon choice is acceptable for certain. (Allthough I’d prefer the extra agi and AP on the slicers).
The real issue with your other post was the insistence that the axe was that good still. It isn’t. There are several readily available combinations that are better.
BRK, it’s inconsistent to use the Miss Chance and Hit formulas to justify equipping two Fang of Truth two days after dissing it and yet dismiss those formula when they indicate you should be missing. I think it’s time to ask, why aren’t you missing? Possibilities:
- You are missing.
- Your Hit Rating during your Heroic runs is higher than the 149-167 we’ve been led to think.
- The formulas are wrong.
- You’re very lucky.
Regarding the last, a Hit Rating of 149-167 translates to a miss chance of 1.5-0.91% against a level 82; assume 1%. The Armory indicates you’ve been on 8 Heroic runs. Assuming 4 bosses per run and 128 shots per boss, the change that every shot hit is
99% ** (8 * 4 * 128) = 0.00000000000000013 %
I hope this makes it clearer why some folks are disconcerted when you say you aren’t missing at your apparent Hit Rating.
NO NOES MATH!!!!
*head explodes**
Insults, ey?
How appropriate, you fight like a cow!
I like how 50% of these comments are insults, or trying to force thoughts onto BRK or his readers.
I’m a Holy Paladin, my alt is a 63 hunter for when I’m not running Heroics. BRK’s blog made me want to have an alt hunter, and I love reading his stuff, it has helped me tremendously for the things I’ve needed.
It just disgusts me that some of you come here with the sole purpose of reading his blog, and then rudely commenting on the current topic. If you did it in a more respectful way, I’m sure it’d be taken better.
If you don’t like what he’s posting, then have Rilgon go ahead and make his own blog and go read that, while the rest of us read BRK’s.
And on the topic of “Is it acceptable?”. You keep saying “I disagree, because…” He’s not even talking about those scenarios, he’s talking about HEROICS where it’s fine. He’s not talking about a tranq shot for a raid, so why even bring that up? If he were, I’m sure he would say to be 100% hit capped, but he’s NOT.
Healadin you kind of miss the point some of us are getting at…. you housebreak a dog and teach it good habits when its a puppy because a) its easier to write on a blank slate and b) well… its hard to unlearn a lifetime of bad habits.
Though in this case the person doing the training is the best known dogtrainer in the world… he has a regularly updated blog and writes for “pets monthly”…
You dont teach a puppy that its ok to pee on the rug alittle sometimes and then re-teach him later.
Firstly, never once have I insulted BRK. I have always maintained my respect and of admiration of BRK, because in 99% of situations and circumstances, he knows what the hell he’s talking about and he presents it in a way that’s funny and approachable by anyone.
In this instance, he was incorrect, both mathematically (in asserting that the Waraxe was a superior option to a pair of Savage Cobalt Slicers or Fangs of Truth) and ideologically (in stating that missing is acceptable).
Why let yourself get into a mindset that X thing is okay now when down the line, X thing is not going to be okay? Prepare for tomorrow’s more difficult tasks today, and it only makes you better at the easy stuff you fight in the here and now.
And for what it’s worth, I do have a blog. Then again, it only has had about 10,000 hits.
The alternative to very occasional misses invariably is: have no money for repairs, or have no balance in stats like AP, Stam, and Intel.
So I don’t think there’s much point crying about hit rating if the alternative is worse.
The other thing is crying about it with respect to raids. Go on a raid, check your stats, correct inbalances with gemming, chants, gear alternatives. No big deal. Certainly not worth using words like “ideologically.”
You know, I’ve always been of the opinion that some people take this game much too seriously.
Missing multiple times in a battle is a problem, missing once or twice in a whole instance/raid isn’t a big deal. By all means, work your hit rating up… especially if you’re going to join one of those incredibly anal endgame guilds that treat WoW like a job. Its a game, I encourage others to play well and learn all the ins and outs of their class… but perspective gets lost in MMOs too often to gripe over something so stupid.
Just wanted to chime in that I ran OS last night with roughly only 6% +hit using your “Glass Cannon” spec for Hunter and Pet (modified to put 3 points in +hit as opposed to Imp. Tracking) and the Spirit Beast. I’m still using a few pieces of level 80 gear. I still easily pulled #1, putting out something like 2200 DPS and really upsetting our Fury warrior who has better “stats” (AP, Crit, ArP).
Now, of course I’ll be grabbing a few more hit rating points before we really start raiding, but I can still already out-dps the people I’m raiding with. I’m not sure if that’s a good or bad thing.
Perhaps we have a perfectly logical reason why we chose that scope. Since you don’t know why we bought it, and Instead of assuming we made a mistake when we bought it, why don’t you ask?:)
BRK!
What’s the perfectly logical reason why you chose that particular scope?
^_^
<3
No, it’s not. Two days ago we weren’t exclusively running heroics, now we are. Our environment changed, so our concern about our stat-allowing changed, as it should.
And we’re not dismissing the formulas, we’re advocating them! That’s we we published them. There’s a reason to our madness, and what we DO here is to other WHY we do.. the things we do. That’s a terrible sentence, we apologize.
Not according to Recount, we’re not. Could that addon be flawed? You bet. We’ll let someone else troubleshoot that, though.
We dislike the implication that we’re lying. We consume Crit-food when we do heroics, not Hit.
If they are, then the EJ-folks owe us all a free respec.
Let’s hope so!
A better indication would be our Pendant of the Outcast Hero, which cost 25 Emblems of Heroism. Now the first heroic we ran, we forgot to pick up our EoHs for the first two bosses — /noob — and we have
onefive remaining. That’s2832 heroic bosses.Nobody is concerned that we’re not missing. Those who are concerned about anything are the opponents of our stance that, for heroics, it’s not necessary to abandon Agility and Stamina to focus exclusively on reaching the Hit Cap. Oh, and they disagreed that the loot from our other post was such a huge upgrade from our S3 axe as to justify spending 750 gold on new enchants.
Now here’s the fascinating part: We aren’t missing, as best as we can tell, and we’re not at the supposed Hit Cap. Perhaps this is a fabulous opportunity for some enterprising hunter to start collecting Recount reports, assemble a large quantity of data, and prove/disprove the mathematical formulas we’ve come to recognize as Correct from as far back as WoW 2.0. Make a quality report and we’ll publish it here, if you don’t have a website of your own.
When we negotiated the price of our gun down from 3000 gold to 2000 gold, the engineer included the scope for free. How ya gonna pass on /free ?
Who tanked that?? Both the prot Warrior and the DK had really nice damage. It certainly wasn’t the Enhance Shammy.
I’m glad to see the Fang upgrades BRK, and although I know you justified keeping your axe, the Fangs are a lot more powerful.
Of course I’m just jealous you are running heroics while I continue the long grind to 80.
Prot warrior. Tell ya something that’s the biggest non-secret of the xpac: tank-DPS, regardless of class, is wicked.
Why is what sounds like a 40-something white guy (nothing wrong with that) using words like forshizzle? It was moderately funny 3 years ago…but now you just sound like a dork
After all that, you are still wrong, still refuse to be corrected, and rely on your army of ‘BRK SAID IT SO IT MUST BE RIGHT’ readers to act as justification for misleading everyone who reads the blog.
Interesting.
Looking forward to the next time you throw your dummy out of the pram.
What’s the purpose of your post, Abuelo?
Ya, all the tanks I’ve run with have put up really amazing numbers as compared to pre-3.0
Simply incredible to see some of the elititst dps’ers in our pugs almost get outdone by our tanks. Leads to very funny excuses and not a few “nerf tank dps, gawd!”
“”How ya gonna pass on /free ?”"
You’re not.
[...] while reading our esteemed elder statesman’s gleeful post about the need for Hit Rating, and his choice to dual wield the very nice Fang of Truth, it occured [...]
I have equiped the 2 FOT, and put the Titanium Weapon chains on them with the extra 52+ hit i made 200 Hit rating. I have followed BRK since I started playing a year ago and EVRYTHING he has said about balance has ALWAYS helped me and never caused me to have any major shortcomings.
@ Rilgon et al, your math is clear and consice. Remember that math is a language and, as such, it can be misunderstood. If you are talking about Raids, Raids, Raids all the time that is only a small part of the game overall (imho)
This game is situational, remembering that alot of us 40 ish white guys dont get to raid due to RL commitments, so we gear/equip for what works for us.
BRK knows his stuff, but he has never said You must do it this way, instead he has clearly shown what He does and leaves it at that.
Preaching Balance is great and yes it isnt always the aboslutely be all end all
answer for everything.
I have an immense sense of respect for most posters on this site, as you are all obviously very serious and competent players.
Please keep in mind that this is a Game, not RL and in a game like this you play how you want.
Props BRK
~Hunter Noob? BRK Fo’shizzle
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Aman%27Thul&n=Woodrun
P.S. I have bought the Nesingweary 4000 at lvl 79 so upgrade at 80!
@ Woodrun
Edit Titanium Weapon Chain adds 28+ Hit to each weapon not 26+…
Balance is good. We really need Int now more that ever as well. But I think the issue was the emphasis on Stam. Since we have a get-out-of-jail-by-the-skin-of-our-teeth button, stam can’t however take precedence over other stats.
Where stam is most useful is in those raid/heroic AOE situations where there is a constant drain on your health, or when there are those random whacks that you have no idea they are coming.
But in the case of that S3 axe vs the slicers, the point that MANY are still missing is that getting the extra +hit on the slicers (regardless of the exact amount of +hit needed) would allow many of us to drop +hit gems and go with more benefitial stats in those slots. Forgoing the slicers for the axe and ArPen still seems odd, especially with the new math on ArPen.
I’d like to see BRK’s thoughts on ArPen and Haste, which Blizz is intent on feeding us.
I would suggest that we move the deep theorycrafting to the forums. Better to track a discussion there, and that stupid spam filter won’t eat good posts.
/exhausted
im still jealous of your hit luck, during bc i was less than 1% under hit cap, and i missed closer to 2% of the time
for heroics, your hit rating is acceptable (just hopefully you are making a set that has the required hit rating for raiding, which im pretty sure you are)
as far as the scope goes, the higher your crit gets the better 15 dam gets and the worse the crit scope gets. is there a crit% where 15 damage provides more dps, im not sure. but its much more comparable with a high crit (and who can argue with free, means more money for http://www.wowhead.com/?item=43955)
Considering you need hit, is Enchant Weapon: Accuracy (25 hit 25 crit) a better option?
Its kinda sad to see how defensive you’ve been about it BRK. While some people may have been a bit harsh, I think the majority of us have been rational and polite in explaining where were coming from. Why have a comment section if not for discussion?
You’re missing the point it seems, because hit is not the only thing that was wrong with the axe. Completely ignoring hit, the Slicers still have better offensive stats. They give (enchanted with int, as they should be) more mana, RAP, and crit. They only lose in ArP, which Is a really undesirable stat. I’m hoping to see an article soon as to why you’re still gearing for it, as it stands its a very poor DPS increase.
I’m not trying to attack you, but sometimes you have to man up and accept that you’re wrong. The point of this blog is to provide accurate information for the Hunter class, correct? The fact of the matter is, you’re not doing that with these posts. This isn’t an argument over preference or anything like that. The math clearly points towards the Slicers as having superior stats. The stam argument is pretty weak, because as someone who is currently stuck healing in Naxx for his guild (WTB resto shaman app) I can guarantee you that whether you have 12000 or 16000 health doesn’t matter. I’m still going to use the same amount of mana for the same effect on you. You’re not helping anyone by stacking stam over DPS in this case. Like I said in the previous post, you’re going to have enough stam on your gear, I promise. Itll take care of itself, don’t specifically gear for it.
I’m pretty sure there’s a very big misunderstanding with the term “Balance” being used here. Balance isn’t a static thing, it’s fluid based on your environment. However, stats don’t need to be “level” to acquire this balance. Think back to BC raiding. You needed to have about 8k health (unbuffed) to start running Kara due to splash damage and such, SSC and TK you should of had about 9k unbuffed. BT you didn’t need 10k unbuffed, it would have helped, but not nearly as mandatory as the change from Kara to SSC (All of this pre-nerf).
This has the same weight now as it did then. Even for heroic bosses your hit was low, though now it’s better. Your stam is high. It’s VERY high. I run heroics and such with 13-14k health (again unbuffed) depending on if I’m in my hit gear or crit gear, and I -don’t- die. I feel confident in my own health enough to even be willing to lower the amount of health I have, raid buffed I hit about 18k. I don’t need sta on anymore gear for awhile, so I’m fairly sure your arguement of being balanced and needing stam to keep you alive is “borked”. If your still dying with 15k unbuffed, then leave the group. You shouldn’t have aggro, you don’t get one shotted for 15,000+ from splash damage in heroics, you don’t need this much stamina, you need more hit and crit at this point. THAT is balance.
Your hit rating is alright. Should it be higher? Yes. Does it -need- to be higher? No. You can raid with 0 hit rating if you want and still do alright. But against that level 83 boss, your going to be losing 9% of your DPS (obviously negating RNG). You didn’t need to burn 1000g if all your doing is running heroics either. You could have been fine with getting cheaper substitutes for a lot less, that’s your line of logic not mine.
Our guild was goofing off in SWP the other day and I did 3k DPS (with a solo / leveling spec) with the same buffs as you except I had Leader of the Pack. Leader of the pack doesn’t increase someones DPS by 1k, I’m sorry but that isn’t and wouldn’t be true. I did all of this with 2400 AP and a 19.77 crit rate unbuffed. All of this sustained over 3 and a half minutes (while your fight lasted 2:27). Only piece of gear I have enchanted at that time was my cape with 16 agi, I’m gather mats for the rest of it.
You could say RNG happened that fight. And that would be mostly true, if it weren’t for the fact that I did 2k during trash pulls without using trinkets or BW, and 2.5k on some fights (closer to 2.7 overall). You really -can’t- show a DPS log saying your doing fine when people with worse gear are doing better.
If we were planning on running Naxx tomorrow, that’s the exact enchant we would’ve gone with. But right now, we don’t have a crushing need for more Hit Rating; we’re happy with where we are.
If BRK runs with my Draenei Priest, he won’t miss.
Heroic Presence(Draenei Racial passive) : +1% hit
BRK’s 167 + Heroic Presence = 199.79
So as long as BRK runs heroic’s with a draenei, BRK is 2 points over cap.
Learn to love your Space Goats.
Bah, I love reading your musing BRK but I will have to jump on the bandwagon here.
Not so much as to say you are wrong, because unlike most of the philistines I understand everyone has a right to their opinion on matters. So here is mine:
Balance –
Is a good thing, if you keep in mind of what you need to balance around. 15k health is a wonderful thing to have, but at this point it really may be overkill. Even in heroics there is not all that much Splash damage that can not be healed through by an adequate healer.
Hit rating -
Well here is the rub everyone is speaking of. What can you do to increase yours? Well, the basic things are there to be had if you want to take them. I am not talking about uber expensive things you should be doing, but the simple ones that it seems like you have just not seen or bothered with yet.
It is true that Blizzard has basically come out and say that hit rating is something you will need to gem and enchant for in the wrath. While Accuracy on any blue weapon, is just plain idiotic. Dropping one of the most insanely cheap hit rating enchants in Icewalker on your boots is a no brainer. Adding 12hit/12crit for such a small cost compared to EVERYTHING else you have done thus far is just … well its just.
Reputation management is the next key. The Argent Crusade has easily one of the best chestpieces in the game currently for a hunter and hit rating. The 49 hit and a yellow socket makes this a single piece that could bring you awfully close to a raid level of hit rating.
Mitigating factors –
The only buff that matters for hit is Heroic Presence. Its group wide, not raid wide, so do not think that just because we got a Draenei you are safe. With the loss of Imp FF, we all need to think a bit more about our hit raiting.
Finally -
Stuff is easy. Stupid easy. Naxx 25 can be effectively pugged through several wings if people will listen. This is NOT TBC where starter raiding was difficult. This is not Vanilla where every shot a hunter made counted. Even the one fight where hunter’s need to use Tranq (Gluth), it really just doesnt matter if he stays enraged, the extra damage is not over powered in the 10man, and in the 25man it is said to be laughable again. (Plus a rogue is much more adept and removing Enrage now than a hunter anyway). It does not even matter if a 1-2 shots of your MD miss anymore either. Tank threat is so high these days, plus Tricks of the Trade from rogues, will be adequate enough.
All the Hit Rating is godly stuff that happened before is just plain wrong. Hit rating is still the single best stat to cap to increase your overall dps. But its diminishing returns are much more noticeable in a world of haste, int, agi and crit being all useful to a hunter, unlike preWrath.
BRK where are you in the Drake-Mounted Crossbow (Heroic UK drop) vs. Nessingwary 4000 debate?
I can’t for the life of me remember where I got this from. All props go to the orignal author.
9% -> 296 Hit Rating
6% ( Talent ) -> 197 Hit Rating
5% ( Talent + draenei ) – > 164 Hit Rating
Detailed hit for boss level:
Level 80 Hit Information
Hit Rating to Hit % Stat
32.79 Hit Rating = 1% Hit
——————————————————————————–
Base Hit Caps
vs. Level 80 mob: 5.0%, 163.95 HR
vs. Level 81 mob: 5.5%, 180.35 HR
vs. Level 82 mob: 6.0%, 196.74 HR
vs. Level 83 mob: 9.0%, 295.11 HR
——————————————————————————–
With Focused Aim Talent Points
(1 Point)
vs. Level 80 mob: 4.0%, 131.16 HR
vs. Level 81 mob: 4.5%, 147.56 HR
vs. Level 82 mob: 5.0%, 163.95 HR
vs. Level 83 mob: 8.0%, 262.32 HR
(2 Points)
vs. Level 80 mob: 3.0%, 98.37 HR
vs. Level 81 mob: 3.5%, 114.77 HR
vs. Level 82 mob: 4.0%, 131.16 HR
vs. Level 83 mob: 7.0%, 229.53 HR
(3 Points)
vs. Level 80 mob: 2.0%, 65.58 HR
vs. Level 81 mob: 2.5%, 81.98 HR
vs. Level 82 mob: 3.0%, 98.37 HR
vs. Level 83 mob: 6.0%, 196.74 HR
——————————————————————————–
With Draenei Racial (+1% Hit)
vs. Level 80 mob: 4.0%, 131.16 HR
vs. Level 81 mob: 4.5%, 147.56 HR
vs. Level 82 mob: 5.0%, 163.95 HR
vs. Level 83 mob: 8.0%, 262.32 HR
——————————————————————————–
Draenei With Focused Aim Talent Points (+1% + Talent Bonus)
(1 Point)
vs. Level 80 mob: 3.0%, 98.37 HR
vs. Level 81 mob: 3.5%, 114.77 HR
vs. Level 82 mob: 4.0%, 131.16 HR
vs. Level 83 mob: 7.0%, 229.53 HR
(2 Points)
vs. Level 80 mob: 2.0%, 65.58 HR
vs. Level 81 mob: 2.5%, 81.98 HR
vs. Level 82 mob: 3.0%, 98.37 HR
vs. Level 83 mob: 6.0%, 196.74 HR
(3 Points)
vs. Level 80 mob: 1.0%, 32.79 HR
vs. Level 81 mob: 1.5%, 49.19 HR
vs. Level 82 mob: 2.0%, 65.58 HR
vs. Level 83 mob: 5.0%, 163.95 HR
Wow, first a mammoth and now all this. How do you afford your oh so lavish lifestyle kitty?
Actually when I hit 78 last night I decided while in IF to go hit a level 70 target dummy just to see what my dps was like, albeit with my gorilla pet. When I checked recount I had 5 misses against the mob!
Given that I am 8 levels higher than it and have around 130+hit I was more than a little surprised to see this.
Perhaps recount is a little borked???
Coming to this debate late cause I was traveling for the holidays.
This thread is surprising to me. Not so much because of the debate, but because of the vociferous level of discourse. Just to clear the air, I think hit>crit>Agi>Int>haste>ArPen. There’s some fluidity there, but that’s where I stand.
I’ll ignore the troll-posts, except to say that, while they are a pain in the ass, I suspect they exist for the same reason that BRKs site is so popular. This is an open comment board, where any person can post a comment, provide a personal story, challenge a fact or issue, post a question, and of course be a complete jerk-off. Most of the other Blogspotters don’t provide that opportunity. Their readership/hits pales in comparison. Most are really good, and provide excellent perspective on their class. But as far as I have been able to ascertain, you have to be a blogger yourself, or at least post some internet-personal information, to even have the opporunity to post. Most people just won’t be bothered.
As to the questions of hit and balance, gearing is a very fluid process, particularly right now. One new drop can completely wreck a spec, and while this is always true, most of us are getting 1-2 drops PER DAY. You balance however you can. BRK’s challenge is to blog about Moments in Time. Yet, people then come back and blast him for his decisions. The emphasis on the S3 axe then the switch to FoTs is a perfect snapshot of this. S3 enchanted is better than most blues non-enchanted prior to 80. Once at 80, enchanting a blue with a 500g enchant is actaully pretty silly. Yes, even the cobalt slicers, because one trip into Naxx-10 or -25 may end up replacing one or both of those.
The other thought I have comes from a comment Rilgon made in his blog as over as SES (StabilzedEffortScope). Raiders read BRK for insight. Raiders also read SES. And Raiders shoudl absolutely read EJ. And any serious raider that accepts what they read on those websites as dogma should be flogged. Even though the EJ site has a lot of information that is nearly dogmatic, there are plenty of posts that are wrong. The EJ community corrects the poster and sets them right, but that’s still at this moment in time. The discussions about the “top” DPS BM spec is a perfect example – we simply don’t know for sure right now, and in fact there may not be one. As a raider, it is MY personal responsibilty to understand MY class. This blog, SES, EJ, WoW forums /cringe, and several others, including self-described lazy hunter Mania, provide insight. But I have to figure out how best to apply that.
Non-raiders, on the other hand, can only ever read BRK, and will be absolutely fine. In fact, by reading BRK, non-raiding hunters will become MUCH better at their class, EVEN IF BRK is wrong in view of the greater hunter community. Hopefully, they read the comments. But even if they don’t, they are still better off.
So, /salute BRK. And /salute Rilgon. And /grovel Whitecow. And /smack any raider who steadfastly believes everything they read. And /praise non-raiders trying to imrpove their play-styles.
/steps off soapbox.
A very late response that probably no one will see:
Regarding Hit Rating, it looks like WotLK has changed the miss formula. On Sunday a “Hit rating” thread was created in the Elitist Jerks Hunters forum (http://elitistjerks.com/f74/t37714-hit_rating/), and reports of unexpectedly low miss rates soon followed. The general observation is that the hit cap for raid bosses has been reduced to 8%.
An interesting related observation from the thread is that the added Hit from the Focused Aim talent does not apply to pets, making FA less useful to BM hunters for whom pet DPS is more significant.
The following image linked in the thread illustrates both points: http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/2577/hit8pv0.jpg It is also amusing: BigRedKitty is missing.
I am happy to see this! Every other hunter and their pet are blasting me every time I walk through Dalaran with my Spirit Beast about how horrible their DPS is compared to cat or devilsaur, although I am always 40(ish)% of the damage in 5 mans and blow every hunter I play with that has a cat out of the water, yes I have noticed these bugs in effect, but thanks for giving me some more data to back up my side!
As far as the actual context of this, I always maintain full hit, regardless of what combination of gear/gems/focused aim points/enchants I have to make. As soon as I upgraded from those Fang of Truths (I have had 4 upgrades since those), I lost a lot, but was able to make it up elsewhere. It seems like for a while there my upgrades from blues to 10 man naxx gear was killing my hit, but a couple 25 man naxx runs later and 2 pieces of T7 with full enchants/gems/etc. I only talent one point in to focused aim and I beleive I am .3% off from full hit but never miss even though you always have a chance.
I think you ALL, including BRK, seem to have missed an exceptionally important thing in all these calcualtions and maths. The standard unconquerorable 1% miss chance on bosses no longer exists. Therefore to get your hit capped its not 9% anymore but 10%.
This is 330 hit not 297.
Thats without a SquidGoatMan, we rule for saving hit expense, and 3 points in focussed fire.
You can get enough +hit to make sure you NEVER miss. No RNG misses anymore, Blizz said so in a blue post i spotted over on MMO-Champ, and i confirmed it with a GM.
I’m this impressed.
NOT.
How about you spec proper and do a long enough fight for the dot to count? My scorpid(!) in my non-exotic (Read: I value DPS over level 2 shiny pidgeys) spec does 2k DPS in 10mans. 4k dot ticks are not something to be trifled with.
Now stop flooding every newb huntard’s brains with “ZOMG LOQUE IS LE BEST PET HANDS DOWN”.
Callidon: You’re retarded. This change affected ONLY spells. The hitcap is the same (rumors on the internets suggest it’s been lowered to 8%) so it’s back to 297 rating for you. Learn some game mechanics before making retarded and asinine comments.
Firstly:
CALM THE HELL DOWN!
Its people like you that flame incessantly with your offensive comments that devalue almost every thread on every blog/forum going about WoW.
Secondly:
The change affected physical and Spell mechanics. The fact that the two had their mechanics merged to use the same values should be evident to you if you really ARE elitst, if not, you are infact, just a jerk.
I’m so late posting a comment to this that it might not even be viable anymore. But here’s my thought on the whole thing.
The two views being expressed are both valid, but with the tie going to BRK and here’s why.
It has been argued time and time again that your Hit Rating is not the end all or be all stat. Since hunters seem to be on a 2 Roll system, it does seem that it would make since to stack it, but then again there is a point of deminishing returns. Even the best raiders and theorycrafters have stated if your 1 – 1 1/2% off hit cap in favor of +Crit or another BALANCED stat then you were more than okay. More than that, then reconsider.
Finally, the topic of Hit Cap is being debated. We’re finding that the cap may be 8% and not 9%. It seems the game mechanic might have changed when they changed the pet hit mechanic.
To Calidon –
Actually? Your incorrect on your assumptions of a 10% hit cap. There hasn’t been anything that I’ve found to point that one out. I’d be happy to discuss this with you off of BRK’s site, but I can assure you, the current debate (highlighted by Drotara of Less QQ, More Pew Pew and Lactose over on EJ’s is that it seems that the Hit Cap is at 8% with the possibility of the additional 1% being related to the change of how the Pet Hit Mechanic works.
BRK – Could you at least give me props for providing the info found in the comment “Furnurgler on November 30th, 2008 6:03 pm “.
Thanks.
I give you props Brigwyn.
Nicely stated.
/target Brigwyn
/cheer